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They are getting them from Amazon, Gearbest, Newegg, etc and moving their sim. Not only is that kinda dumb but it violate the fair use act in most cell TOS. For their price, they are some of the best in-ear headphones you can buy.

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This site continues to be among the most informative. And could this be the site? Just as it would be common sense that folks would have a good reverse osmosis filter on their home water. 6 inch android phones questions It seems like where they do best, for example TVs, are already covered by reputable sources projector central, av forums, etc. I bought these a couple days ago at a Walmart.

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Dieter November 15, at A lot of these things you say you simply "don't need" them, and that's how I feel about root. Andrei Girbea August 19, at 7:

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Well, what you want is unsealed earbuds. Many competitors in our tests struggled with that issue. I bought a pair of the Delta. Possibly in a future update!

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08.02.2018 - We have them archived. And, the shirt clip seems like an afterthought thrown into the box. I could imagine that less technical savvy users who failed return the router on time would waste their money and would have to buy another router. OK — potentially stupid question. TH October 23, at 7: You make it sound like it is something really and truly unique with such coverage and that your Samsung is a marvel because it offer it. And why is everyone on New Egg a tech genius with level 5.

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09.02.2018 - Eric Geier, Quality of Service explained: With either of those routers, you would need to create two network names and join your devices to each of them intelligently to get acceptable results. My credit cards follow a standard, why should I pick myself into a specific device OEM just to pay? Other sites and magazines which I have worked for are beholden to ads to fund their existence.

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It still seems like your logic is flawed. If you're really that pissed at Netflix, don't use it. Use a different service instead of supporting them by borrowing it off a friend, as they are also giving them money and support, too via their subscription.

How is using their service for free "supporting" them? They aren't getting any revenue off you if you're not paying them. Saying you're supporting them by not paying them is a little stupid don't you think?

You're doing the opposite of supporting. You're getting the benefits of their service while stopping payment and adding to server load which they pay for. You seen like an incredulous douch who I'd suplex onto a park bench for being a lap dog bitch.

How is canceling or stealing not doing something. Also, its not a fucking macbook jerkoff its a paid service for TV on a phone they expect to be paid for. And you are a loud mouth keyboard warrior that loves to talk a big game, but in reality have little to no control over anything and use web forums to spout obscenities and violent threats to make yourself feel better.

Just another step that makes pirating the same content more convenient Funny thing is their content is available to stream all over the internet. Don't see how this move fights piracy as long as computers have access.

Dude I root my phone to just get iPhone emojis and to tether without my carrier knowing. Like I'm not stealing anything this will just make me stop paying for Netflix.

Just a heads up. Those treating hiding mods are fake. There is no way to hide if from the carrier. Heck if they wanted to they could see every web page you load from a ton of different places and ways.

All you have to due to bypass tethering limits on t-mobile is to change the TTL on the tethered device. That just gets by the automated checks. Get a live person to randomly pick your account not really likely but happens and it is not had to tell if someone is tethering.

All that person will be able to tell is whether customer is using a lot of data or not. And this is the root of the problem: No the issue is people being entitled and taking advantage of things.

You have people running their gaming systems and using hundreds of gb a month. Not only is that kinda dumb but it violate the fair use act in most cell TOS. If people didn't abuse the system then it wouldn't be an issue.

Also just some food for thought. If they can't tell anything more then a lot of data just how do they route the traffic properly? If the carrier wanted to they could tell. I know for a fact that there is a team for both att and Verizon that is tasked with just that.

Allright, tell me this - is it allright for me to watch 4K video on my phone since the screens allow it now? What's the difference between this and me watching the same stream on my laptop over my phone's connection?

How is browsing a site from a laptop different from browsing it from a phone network-congestion-wise? And then it boils down to the same argument - carriers are just hoping you'll use the network less from you phone device, as it's less convenient.

The more convenient smartphones become for consuming large volumes of traffic, the sooner carriers will have to more away from this scan and expose the actual numbers. If carriers would be honest and upfront about "hidden" caps, then people would not be able to game the system.

Tethering was never even an extra charge until people started taking advantage of the mobile networks. Watching 4k videos is not a big deal, using gb of mobile data in a cycle is flat out stupid.

Mobile networks were not designed for that type of traffic from a single device. Nor was it made to handle running your ps4 while you are gaming. Why do you think that pages are made to be mobile friendly?

Not only is it a usability issue but a data usage issue as well. All people have to do is read the TOS. It's all right there. Yet most people just don't want to take the time to do it and then get made about it.

Can't blame the carriers for that. If there are caps - announce them and make it impossible to go over them instead of shaming people who actually decide to take you up on your offer.

Well, carriers are the ones calling their plans "unlimited" and hiding the actual caps either buried deep in the ToS or behind the vague "reasonable usage". So don't blame people for not wanting to wade through pages of legalspeak just to learn that you lied and "unlmited" is just "50Gb and then throttled".

If carriers are concerned about individuals abusing their network, then they need to flag those accounts that use an excessive amount of bandwidth - whether it's through tethering or directly on the device itself.

So it's actually very easy to abuse the system without ever turning on the tethering. Sure you can't block the traffic Which is what these apps do.. What a stupid move.

I pay for the premium for Netflix and I never thought that I might have to cancel my service just because they did this. Wasn't expecting this at all Will be interesting to see how many customers they lose.

Seriously though Windows phones are great. The only problem with them is the lack of applications. Otherwise, it runs great on low-end hardware, has a great UI, the homescreen is innovative, synchronisation with Windows PCs is cool, etc.

Don't forget that you can use the Netflix website on Edge instead of their shitty app, and it streams at full p, even on my L with a p screen. Nope, just p like on android.

The device has to be "certified" and there are no certified windows phones afaik. The WP app doesn't even have downloads yet, I think. Might end with a visit at the apple store in my case.

Windows phone is kind of not supported anymore. Google invented this SafetyNet crap, let anyone use it for any reason Hell, Pokemon GO of all things started using it, and over the last year have been making it even more and more strict and unforgiving.

So no, a HUGE part of the blame does lie on Google for being openly hostile towards rooted users and not giving a damn about them. There are legitimate reasons to use Safetynet to check the integrity of a device: Android Pay or banking apps in general is one example.

It isn't necessarily hostility to root users; it's just a reality that Google need to be able to demonstrate to banks or other third parties that their OS is secure, and that people can't bypass built in security safeguards.

Netflix need to do the same with the studios they redistribute content for; and they've chosen to use Safetynet to do it. Netflix isn't a human right; you have no inalienable right to root your phone and to use Netflix.

Except that not even my own banking app uses SafetyNet, it still has root checking and certain sensitive features are disabled if I am rooted, but not the entire app. Furthermore, it IS hostility to rooted users, because anyone can toss SafetyNet into their app for any reason whatsoever such as games using it "just because" in case of cheaters Google has been completely unwilling to work out ANY sort of compromise or method that can keep a phone secure without basically tossing rooted users under the bus.

I am saying that they didn't even try. PCs by default obviously allow admin accounts all the time, even as the main user account as much as that is not recommended yet can maintain security.

Google when they were confronted with people who were hurt by SafetyNet, legitimate users mind you, basically just shrugged them off and didn't even bother considering what could be done to allow the device to remain secure while also having such safeties in place.

I mean, all these apps that you can use on your phone, can also be used on a PC, many of them available in either a browser or native app format, yet it remains secure.

There is no reason this could not be done with Android, especially considering it used Linux as a base, they are just refusing to even consider it. Don't you already have that choice? Your phone is sold without root access i.

If you do choose to root your device, you will lose access to some Safetynet enabled applications. You can, of course, unroot if necessary. Second, it shouldn't have to be a choice.

How many PC apps refuse to run under an admin account? I shouldn't have to choose between having root access or being able to use a apps that more and more are starting to add this nonsense to them.

It's ridiculous to claim one should be able to have one or the other, even SafetyNet could have been designed to not be this brokenly strict, but Google had no interest in doing so, and they are rapidly making having root more and more useless while we still have to deal with all the junk they force on your phone from the manufacturer Well, it is what it is.

You believe you shouldn't have to make a choice, whereas I believe life is all about making choices and living with the outcomes. We seldom get everything we want, and neither Netflix, nor rooting, are inalienable rights.

That's not even an argument, that's just trying to claim that the status quo should remain for no reason other than it is the status quo. It shouldn't have to be a choice, and arguing that people have to choose between root and having an increasingly less amount of apps just because "it is what it is" is insanity.

In fact, it wasn't even the status quo before until Google started pulling this nonsense with SafetyNet a short while ago. That doesn't mean people should just accept it.

It's not an argument, because there is no argument to be had. The reality of the situation is self-evident; you can't have a rooted device and install Netflix via Google Play.

Accepting the status quo has nothing to do with it; it's simply acknowledging reality. You have to choose what's more important to you; Netflix or rooting your phone. Finding the reality frustrating, as you clearly do, won't make it any less real.

If this was a serious discussion on human rights; censorship, migration, justice, gender equality etc. But this isn't anything like that. This is two for-profit corporations, Google and Netflix, who provide services to which you have no fundamental right to access, nor any obligation to use.

You can choose to pay for their services and accept their terms and conditions, or you can choose not to. You don't get to pick the terms and conditions of the service someone else is providing you; however you are free to not use the service if you don't like the terms and conditions under which they are provided.

That's it; it's no simpler or more complicated than that. Ranting on the internet about how unfair you perceive it to be is irrelevant. Again, there is no "it is what it is" argument.

You are basically saying that people should not complain about this just because "it is what it is". You aren't even making any rational arguments anymore, just re-stating what the current situation is and then basically claiming that people should not want or expect better.

Netflix, like every other for-profit enterprise in a capitalist system, will either succeed or fail based on its ability to turn a profit. Right now, Netflix is turning a profit, and clearly thinks it can be more profitable by excluding rooted users whose theoretical ability to circumvent DRM restrictions may impact its ability to secure rights to new content.

Clearly you disagree with their stance, and the only way to see for sure if your disagreement is warranted is to watch their financial performance from here on out.

You've chosen to root your phone, and Netflix have recently chosen to exclude rooted users. That leaves you with a choice to make. Even if you think that choice is unfair, even if you think you should be able to have both.

The reality is you can't have both, and you will have to choose. Again, Netflix isn't a right. Go elsewhere if you disagree with their business practices; that's how capitalism works.

Also, drop this "right" nonsense. No, seriously, drop it right now. People are paying for a Netflix account, they DO have a right to get the service they paid for. Netflix made zero warning or mention of this impending block, they pulled it out of nowhere for paying customers.

So sorry, but they DO have a right to the service, since they are paying for it. Sony was found to be legally in the wrong when they removed the OtherOS feature from the PS3, because why?

There is no argument; it's the reality of the situation. I do understand why Netflix want to tighten their DRM procedures, and I do understand why some people have been left frustrated by this change.

The reality is, however, if you want to download the Netflix app via Google Play, you will need an un-rooted phone; such as the phones used by the majority of Android users. That's all that's happening.

I get that you don't like it. But stamping your foot and shouting 'no fair, no fair' achieves nothing. Netflix are entitled to run their business how they see fit within the law; and consumers get to choose whether they want to give Netflix their business or not.

That's all there is to it. Don't like the way Netflix do business; don't give Netflix your money. All you are doing with the "it is what it is" argument is just repeating what the article is saying.

That is not conductive to anything. Anyone who has read the article knows what is happening right now. And sorry, but you are doing the same stamping your foot with the "well, it is what it is" argument.

Not to mention that you are also wrong, because over the last 5 or so years ALONE there have been dozens of examples of consumers speaking out against policies or DRM and the companies begin forced to reverse it from the backlash.

So you are doing nothing but hurting legitimate users by trying to argue "it is what it is". And again, no, they are not entitled to run their business in a way that without warning locks customers out of what they paid for, Sony tried this So sorry, but you are wrong, and you have been nothing but wrong this entire argument.

Netflix isn't' "entitled" to do this, people DO have a reason to complain, there IS a reason to complain, complaining HAS changed such practices before, and all you are doing is further hurting legitimate users by attempting to insist the "it is what it is" non-argument.

Your entire argument has been fundamentally wrong from the start. It's not my argument; it's simply Netflix's position. I get you don't agree with it, but it's totally valid for Netflix to wish to strengthen their DRM procedures.

No it's not an argument. Again, there is no argument necessary; the reality of the situation is self-evident, and no amount of arguing here will change it. You should have known that by rooting your phone you are modifying the device beyond its factory specification.

You should have known that this essentially makes you responsible for the proper operation of the device; you no longer have the device manufacturer or Google to turn to when software that you have modified doesn't work as expected.

You should also have known that rooting prevents a device from complying with the compatibility test suite, and that this can affect your devices ability to function correctly.

You can't blame Google for this; as before, once you modify your device beyond its factory spec, you're responsible for supporting yourself. Rooting a device is at the owners risk.

You've now found yourself in a situation where a modification you have made to your device prevents you from accessing a service you want to use. That's on you; no-one made you modify your device, no-one said they would take responsibility for the changes you have made to your device, and rooted users are expected to assume liability for any ramifications and complications they face as a result of their decision to modifying their device.

This documentation is publicly available. You went ahead and rooted your device anyway. You're free to carry on using Netflix if you return your device to a state where the integrity of the device can be verified.

Or you're free to carry on using a rooted device and living with the compromises that entails. Furthermore, despite there being plenty of examples of complaining doing EXACTLY what you claim it cannot do, that is to change such decisions, you keep repeating that "complaining will do nothing".

You are a broken record, arguing the same "it is what it is" argument over and over so you can avoid actually thinking. An argument and yes, no matter how much YOU stomp your feet that it is not, it IS an argument that has already been disproven over and over and over.

You also ignored that there are many countries where phones are already sold rooted, or how such things don't effect using such services on a PC with admin rights which are the same thing, or the dozens of other holes in your logic large enough to sail a ship through.

There is no "you should have been aware" because this is a total lapse in common sense and my device is in no way incompatible from a hardware or software level, but rather, the app is purposely rejecting it.

Furthermore, they made no prior warning whatsoever. This is like arguing "you should have known modern cars could be remotely disabled" if a dealership decides to just disable all cars with an aftermarket radio installed.

I don't know where to even begin with all the broken wrong logic in that last post. You are free to carry on being a living example of "First they came", but don't come crying about how nobody else is listening to you because you could not possibly be any more wrong.

I DO have a right to use Netflix on my device, rooted or no, if I am paying for it. If you argue against this, you are wrong. People DO have a right and have many many MANY times in the past to challenge the "it is what it is" status quo, if you argue against this, you are wrong.

I have been more than patient with your insane thick-headnedness. At this point I can't tell if you are being willfully ignorant or really are just that ignorant.

Or just trolling, that is an option as well. There is no way anyone rational at this point can continue to argue the insanity that you have argued. I interpret personal insults as an indicator that the individual making them no longer has any faith in their actual arguments, and so I think it's time to call time on this particular discussion.

As you've pointed out, neither of us is getting anywhere. It's been fun, but once it starts getting abusive, the fun has to stop. It's a shame, because DRM Vs individual user rights has the potential to be a really interesting discussion topic.

I hope you get what you're after; and that the reality of the situation will change to be more in line with what you think it should be. Unfortunately I imagine the situation regarding DRM and rooted devices will only get more restrictive going forward.

You purposely instigate people into losing their patience with you, and then claim "I win because you got angry", especially when the anger is because you were refusing to understand the entire argument throughout this entire mess.

Root is, by definition, unsecure. Any time you have userland processes that have access to ring0 you are inherently unsecure, as there are no restrictions placed upon running code at that point.

And yet, there are ways to run it securely on PCs. Netflix and online banking would not be available on PCs if it wasn't. TANs are generated with an air-gapped extra device.

TANs on the phone are in general not safe and if the TAN is able to be generated offline, someone could use an exploit to root, steal the secret for TAN generation and boom, it's over. My Bank Hypovereinsbank more or less recently blocked root and well I just RootCloaked that thing into oblivion and can do my stuff.

Sorry, this is absolutely wrong. You can still delete System32, it's just mildly harder than it used to be. If "new and default users" were not Admin accounts, they couldn't install software, so Default user accounts are higher than Limited accounts, but not as high as Admin accounts.

That's why they can install software. Linux users are not admins but can still install software, right? You can still run things AS admin by giving the permission at runtime, but since all that requires is pressing a button if your built-in admin account isn't passworded, which it isn't by default, one step forward two back, sigh and most users are too "stupid" to simply not press that button.

This means they're an Administrator. They have Administrative privileges. The fact that certain actions are blocked until you click "yes" on a simple UAC prompt doesn't stop this; they're in "Admin Approval Mode", which can be disabled via GPO if you care to.

If you buy a computer from Dell example, set it up, then go to System32 and start deleting. That account is disabled out-of-the-box. Please, you're digging a bigger hole trying to look "right".

How to prove this: Set up a new computer. Set up user default for MS. But I'm not a Netflix customer and won't become one. Whahaha, this has to be the most retarded move of the year in any category even Trump can't top this.

I'm glad i don't use Old Crap Flix. When he can vote in our elections I'll take his opinions of our elections seriously. It is highly ill-informed anyhow. Timeout, you are a Trump supporter?

No interest in your opinion neither anyone smart in the world. I wonder how long they'll stick with that premise seeing as how much public opinion expressed here is against them. Get the APK somewhere else or install magisk and hide your root.

Too many people root their devices and have a good reason for doing so and Netflix should not penalize them. Dude, normal people don't give a fuck about rooted phones.

It's just the elitist twats who do it anymore. Most people who root seem to be. The sentiment among rooters is "if you don't root your phone, you're not as good as me and don't deserve to have a phone.

Root you stupid noob! I've yet to see that Maybe you just feel like that because they do in fact know more than you? My first version of Android was 1.

I've seen it for many years. How long have you been in the scene? It isn't just rooted phones - Also unlocked. Elitists get their iphones and galaxy s8s from att and verizon.

Normal people get their devices from amazon, ebay, newegg, gearbest etc. I'm sure Netflix are terrified that the tiny fraction of Android users who come to this site, and the similarly tiny fraction who root their phones, are bothered.

The rest of the world won't care. People aren't getting their phones from ATT, Verizon, etc any more now that they have to pay full retail and don't get a free or heavily discounted flagship device with contract renewal.

They are getting them from Amazon, Gearbest, Newegg, etc and moving their sim. If I owned stock in Netflix right now, I'd sell it quick on this news. Everything that isn't already mobile is going mobile.

Swapping providers is as easy as changing the sim. Almost every person I know owns an Android device, but i'm the only geek who flashes and roots his devices. It isn't just rooted phones but also unlocked phones.

Got your phone on amazon? Got it on ebay? Got it from gearbest? Got it from newegg? No netflix for you without jumping through enough hoops that you'll actually know about rooting by the time you get it done.

Are we conflating a carrier-unlocked vs. They are two distinctly different things, and I doubt that having a carrier-unlocked phone i. Judging from the posts here it looks like nobody who roots their phone uses Netflix anyway so I guess it's moot.

But the outcry sure did get them a bunch of free publicity. This is what Magisk is for. Magisk still requires that you unlock your bootloader, which is enough to trigger safety net these days, so that won't work.

I understand that Magisk is a great tool for modifying my system without actually modifying it. I understand that there are many modules that allow you to do things like hide root, bypass security modules, skin your system, and plenty of other things.

What I don't understand is how you can install magisk without unlocking your bootloader. Back when I originally tried it out with pokemon go, it worked well for a while, but eventually even just having my bootloader unlocked was all it took to throw SafetyNet.

If that's not an issue anymore, then great! But maybe say that instead of being snarky. LOL the recovery doesn't stop working after a bootloader is locked, only fastboot won't flash images but the recovery can do whatever it wants to, update the rom, edit system files etc.

That's nonsense, the recovery works fine with or without a locked bootloader. Only fastboot won't work but that's only needed when you don't have a custom recovery to flash images.

In this case all it takes is a kernel that supports Magisk and hides the fact that the bootloader is unlocked, at which point with Magisk Hide enabled all root and SafetyNet checks pass. I'll have to look back into this then, last time I used magisk it wasn't as capable, glad to see it's come this far.

Can Magical Hide hide that my bootloader is unlocked? Serious question, not being sarcastic or snarky as I was below. Magisk itself doesn't hide an unlocked bootloader it only hides root but must custom roms simply delete the verifiedbootstate - flag which in turn makes safetynet pass even with an unlocked bootloader.

Some older devices don't have this flag in their kernels in the first place so safetynet will accept that the flag is missing. Link to the patch that most custom roms kernels to be specific have to pass safetynet: This has been happening for a week now.

I tweeted it to Ruddock a few days ago. Just didn't put together that it was because I was unlocked. Google really needs to start stealing from the root community the way apple takes from the jailbreak community.

It feels like rooting is way down except for a few legal use cases. This kind of stuff starts to make rooting unpleasant. I already can't use fingerprint auth in my banking app any more because root.

I used rooms for like 8 years maybe? And a lot of the "new features" always come of the rom or root comunity. I'm trying to stay indoors, but is complicate Greenify for example, works at no root devices nowadays But is way better with root and Xposed Doze can't compare against Greenify Maybe at version number 20 root wouldn't be necessary I flashed a custom ROM on my Nexus 6 because stock was so slow that it was getting unusable, but screw me right?

In my country lots of stuff doesn't work on unrooted devices. My bank app, payment app and local cable TV and digicorder app all stopped working. Also s-health doesn't work anymore and soon Netflix.

Few people I've talked to online know what they're doing when it comes to root. Most of those end up breaking things. Rooting is far too easy and probably shouldn't exist at all.

You could say the same about anything, not just modification of phones. Maybe you shouldn't own a car if you can't fix it yourself, or have kids if you aren't a doctor. Rooting isn't easy, it's made easy by the hard work of other people.

It's not up to you what other people do with their property, you have no right to say that they shouldn't. And if someone breaks their phone, what does it have to do with you? It's their hobby and their phone.

You're not their daddy. You could use magisk su hide for the moment. I too use a banking app that cannot be used on normal root proocess. Hrmm, every time I hear Kodi, I think of pirated content.

Even bad publicity is good publicity. They are not going to publicly come out and say it, but the add-on's are the only reason they're well known. I rather say Fusion and Exodus et al instead since Kodi is Kodi and you have to install what you want.

Kodi is open source. If Kodi stops wanting to be as useful as it is now, someone will fork it and keep it doing what its users enjoy. Kodi is just an open source media player. To watch any pirated content you either need to download it or install an unaffiliated plugin that streams from pirated sources.

That's BS my friend, Kodi xbmc has started on the original xbox and was made and used as a media player. So I think not a big problem. No, it won't work. Safetynet always fails if you have closed activated, or if you just have an unlocked bootloader.

Sometimes even by just having adb debugging turned on. I mean debugging is a core part of developing and any developer probably has it active. Yes, it's wrong, whatever, the point is streaming services made it easier for people, which outweighed the hassle of pirating it.

You're right, this kind of thing is what will get people to start doing it again more. If I can't use Netflix on my rooted phone, it's Netflix that'll go, not the root. Primarily for system level ad-blocking.

None of the non-root options can even compare. I refuse to allow ads when they have the ability to fill the entire screen and vibrate the phone. Even with being able to block ads, I still purchase the ad-free option of apps I support.

This will also have negative impact on many devices and average consumers even if they never unlock or root. A lot don't have Google certification, such as upcoming OEMs.

Then theirs beta roms like Xiaomi and OnePlus that run awesome. My first though after suddenly realizing i am on some ancient Netflix version and Googling why in the word it is no longer available and reading the article above was "what The moment it refuses to run on my rooted devices, my subscription is getting cancelled.

As simple as that. I was about to become a subscriber of Netflix after seeing House of Cards by PirateBay but now through the official channel because I thought that Netflix deserved my money But this movie will keep me at PirateBay I have a Moto G5 that I could unlock and root and I didn't it just because I wanna see how things are nowadays without root And I use a lot of apps that would work better with root Greenify for example So I would be able to use Netflix And I won't and will stay that way only because this douchebag move So happy that I waited till House of Cards release to become a subscriber Netflix should learn something from Frank Underwood Yes, because illegally pirating from huge corperations which constantly attempt to and successfully brainwash people into agenda using various tricks, is somehow bad?

You're not supporting the creators of the show, sure. Anyways, with your little money you wouldn't be benefitting anybody. The creators of the show, are well off anyways. Don't companies pay them to have their content on their platform and pay for their production cost and wages?

Then; they've already been payed. I'm not endorsing piracy. It isn't the best thing to do, but I think calling people a "thief" and grouping them with people who have actually stolen things off individuals which mean a lot to the individual and murdered some individuals in the process, is just stupid.

It's not the same as 'stealing' bits of 1s and 0s. Again, I'm not endorsing piracy, however there are a lot of good reasons to pirate movies and TV shows. People leave their families for months to give you works of art.

You can't throw them a few bucks? I'm legit, always will be. Also, tax helps everyone. Your wall of text is just trying to convince yourself, thief. A thief is different from a pirate, besides, they've already been payed.

And I was talking about TV shows and movies, but you're too dense to realise it. If I spend time writing code for software, and decide to sell a monthly license instead of a perpetual license, that is my choice.

Your choice should be to either subscribe to the monthly license, or to find a competitor software to use instead. Choosing to bypass the licensing checks makes you a thief taking something without the owner's permission makes you a thief.

If you want to own the movie and watch it whenever you want it, BUY it. Just because somebody stole your car doesn't mean you can go and steal that person's car in retaliation.

There are laws and procedures on how to handle that. Thousands of unjust laws have been passed. They made actions illegal that were not bad. Theft is when I take your bike and it's gone and you do not have a bike anymore.

When I pirate, are you losing your software or your right to sell your software? Plus, if you actually developed software, I'd probably pay for it since you aren't some big corporation.

Think about if everybody thought like you. Now if that It's the same with the rest of the content creation business. You and me, we're just a drop in the bucket when it comes to their revenue, but instead of scooping it out a spoonful at a time while adding water by the cup, somebody dumped the bucket over, there would be no money left to pay the content creators before content is even made.

The only moral of the story is: Pay for legit services then and watch posted content - the creators get paid and you get proper content without restrictions.

The day the industry realize that DRM, geo blocking and so forth are counter productive will be historic. Love my Moto G5 Plus. Best phone I've had so far - and that's coming from a number of Samsung flagship phones.

It's so much snappier and the battery life is insane. Noticed this a little while ago. The crazy thing is I'm not even rooted or interested in any mods. I needed to sideload the latest version 7.

I'm keeping the bootloader unlocked so I can recover if my phone boot loops. I rarely use Netflix on my phone but this is kind of annoying. I suspect this has something to do with offline movie watching which is amazing.

You don't need to unlock bootloader to sideload the full OTA images that Google publishes on their website. Not everyone feels the same though, I know I sure don't.

The day Netflix stops working on my rooted devices which are what I watch it on, not my TV is the day I'll cancel my service. No big loss compared to losing root. Tasker is interesting but never felt the need for it.

Adaway, titanium are both irrelevant on my S7, I despise gestures beyond simple swiping in the Cardinal directions, and if stock Android is so perfect why do you need to theme it?

I have a s7 edge and the stockrom is full of bloatware from Microsoft, Sansung and Google. More than 20 useless apps are included. So yes the s7 needed root. Never said android is perfect, if it was there wouldn't be any competition in the market or users such as myself who feel the need to customize Android.

Root is not something I push onto others, its just something that I want on my devices and I make choices about what services I use or devices I purchase based upon my ability to do it. Using a non-rooted Samsung without Taller would be like using a feature phone again but with ads.

Having an automated device without ads and bloat is certainly a basic requirement to me. I don't see any ads on my Ericsson GF either. Don't have to install a single piece of software in order to get there.

Ericsson win, Samsung loose.: Your Samsung still has Google ad services and so forth running even if you are blocking them on the "non root level". My devices are completely ad free with Google ads disabled system wide and in all apps.

Samsung loose every time even if their followers are trying to find different "non root methods" to "solve" things that other devices do without any issues due to I disagree, Android is one big advertising if you don't use root.

Apps have ads not every app has a pro version, internet browsing sucks without Adaway build in ad blockers in browsers aren't great, YouTube really sucks if it isn't modded watch a 30 second ad for a 3 minute movie.

And devices are full of bloatware that can't be removed without root. Even the Google stuff are bloatware kiosk, movies, music, books etc. Samsung's Internet has the Adblock extension and it literally blocks everything.

I also use Disconnect Pro and Adhell for system-wide ad blocking. But then, I haven't needed to restore a backup except for switching devices in years, probably because I don't run janky community junkroms.

The only reason you feel that Smart Switch completely replaces Titanium is because you never used other features of Titanium that go beyond what Smart Switch is intended for.

They're not must haves for the masses though but some of us do appreciate their usefulness. I hate this response. If anything, I have found far more reasons to root than ever before.

But you don't even need to root to get blocked. Just using a custom ROM or having an unlocked bootloader triggers it.. I really couldn't understand these kind of stupid moves.

I mean I kinda get for an Android Pay or some banking apps to implement these limitations. But seriously, a frickin' streaming app? Afraid they're gonna get pirated?

For someone who's going to pirate, they probably could just probably reverse engineer the apk and remove the limitations or basically use older apps. Do they really have some idle engineers that they're forced to implement useless feature?

I'll come back when Google fixes this shit. Back to pirating it is. My app stopped working on my N7 when I sideloaded 5. Got an error when trying to play anything.

I went and dropped it back to stock on the latest patch and relocked the bootloader. All working fine now. Too fucking bad, Nougat is fantastic on that device, leaps and bounds better than Marshmallow.

Which ROM and which N7 do you have? I am now on the latest Marshmallow just so that Netflix will work. As long as I can side load it and sign in I'm still ok. It's a pain, but I'd live with that.

But if NF blocks root users from signing in, I'm definitely cancelling and just use one of the very easy pirate apps. As long as you can side load But going from "hidden app in the Play store" to "sideloaded app won't run" is probably on the menu.

You're tired of people being smug in their hobbies, so you gloat about the problems inflicted on them pointlessly? Petty and a hypocrite. Is another person's happiness really that painful for you? You already know that they accomplished nothing more than "successfully followed instructions.

Humbling them is one thing, being an ass is another entirely. Your wrongness-density is impressive. I didn't realize I replied to you twice. You're all over this article, with really, nothing better to do, huh?

I'm probably done stirring shit up anyway, today is water change day on my fish tanks. Are you one of those Samsung Apologists that argue against root and proudly tell everyone about the perfection known as Grace UX Trying to be an "anti-social elitist" is like proudly use Simple Finder on a Mac and tell everyone that you don't need the regular Finder.

I use Samsung, but only because it offers the best mix of software and hardware for me. And package disablers are garbage. Don't forget DT Ignite so the carriers can add their share.

It is always amusing when the Samsung Apologist proudly claim how good it is to live without root and how "mature Android has become" when they are talking about a heavily modified fork of it.

The only thing restricting them from further modification is the CTS in order to be able to use Play. An unrooted Samsung running Grace? It would be like having a feature phone again.

Way too many annoyances and no way of making it more pleasurable since the whole thing is The only area where there are some reminiscence of Android is under the About box.

Samsung is a disgrace not to mention a complete parody on the concept of an Android device. Not to mention their followers who recently "spotted" the bezel less display introduced by Sharp and LG followed by Xiaomi because The most kind thing I can say about that brand is this: Samsung is for the Android device and platform what McDonald's is for the thing called food.

There are way better devices available. Buying a Samsung is like getting a Big Mac the difference is that the Big Mac buyers doesn't claim its superiority - while Samsung buyers always try to claim how "superior" their devices are.

Everything in your first paragraph is purely subjective. I find the design of the Pixel to be ugly, boring and derivative. AOSP design language doesn't appeal to me.

I also think Samsung's software suite is better than Google's. DTIgnite is a Verizon thing. Bezel less phones are sexy, for sure. It is stupidly gorgeous though. I use Samsung because I like the software design.

I like the functionality of the base is and apps, and I like the S-app suite. I really miss my Note 7, and I'll be swapping up to a Note 8 when it's out. Don't get me wrong, Samsung phones have their negatives - chief among them is the fragile design and the screen edge touch rejection sucks ass.

But for me, the positives outweigh the negatives. Other phones have bigger negatives for me. Phone preference are always subjective. Somebody will always have a reason to pick one over another.

Tell me, if Samsung is a "parody" of the concept of an Android device, what is your description of the perfect Android device? I'm guessing it's the Pixel. My Xiaomi Mi Max is excellent but would be even better with the aforementioned hardware I can't fault is existing hardware but I am taking about a new model.

A keyboard flipcover would be a great accessory as well. Sony all the way to me if I really insist. No need for a Samsung in order to get it. The upcoming OnePlus 5 looks promising - they usually get their things right.

MicroSD on that one as well. Let's call it a Note Pro. What I don't like with Samsung are all Apologists making excuses for their policies. I have nothing against them as a company or production.

They can make excellent products but their policies stop them right now. It is too much McDonald's mainstream and too little class at this time. Carrier devices are typically too mainstream than the unlocked ones.

I dont see the point of a digital sound connection on a phone because sound itself is analog by definition and I think the DAC in a multi-hundred euro device is better than in some cheap headphones.

Google Play Movies still works right? Oh yes, so long as Google makes their money Everyone should stop using Netflix. Not sure how I'm gonna get the shows i currently watch on Netflix from bit torrent since they won't be made anymore once Netflix is shut down, but at least I'll have my bit torrent friend.

You can't buy whatever device you want because a content provider disagree. You can't use the system you want because a content provider disagree. You can't use the app you want because a content provider disagree.

The "improper way" is Samsung free, ad free and bloat free - and I don't need several apps because I have just one or two streaming apps, one media player, one book reader and so on. Fast and efficient system to boot.

Perhaps you can tell me the benefit of having Kindle, Kobo and Nook instead of MoonReader for everything. The benefits of having an uprooted system, Netflix, Hulu and a couple of apps for different cable services instead of having just one media center would also be interesting to know more about.

When we are at it: I dont use any of those. Really my only complaint is that they fell apart and that to me the bass knob had no effect really. When I owned these, there was a big hoopla over the JVC harx over the ear headphones.

They sounded so bad I threw them in the garbage I was so disgusted instead of dealing with a return. My meelectronic m6 phones are not as good sounding, but the difference is minimal.

My only real complaint about them is that the headphones have no flanges to hold on the interchangeable tips - so, when taking off my earphones a tip has stayed in my ear a couple times. Seriously either of these headphones are great and neither were reviewed.

One thing I would like to include is that both pairs came with a myriad of different tips. I normally use the long tips with multiple flanges on it as this is the one that inserts into my ears best and produces the best sound quality.

I know that you have to experiment with different tips because everyone ear canals are different. The fact that both pairs came with said tips is a huge reason why I bought them.

This is mostly because I would have appreciated a comparison that included the jvc hafx1x. I want a pair that sound good in all departments, also very comfortable for listening to music for long periods.

And if they stay in or on my ears while I am out running or in the gym would be a great bonus. The sound was fine but the cables were terrible. I just want to thank you guys for taking the time to even bother with in ear headphones that are inexpensive.

I can spot a 4channer easily, considering I used to go there frequently. Thanks again and I hope you dedicate more time to inexpensive products in other categories. I got a pair of the Panasonics and my first thought was these feel flimsy and cheap.

They fit well, sounded good, and broke in about a week. Can you recommend a pair that sounds decent with a mic, and you think might hold up better? However, I regret it.

The first thing I did when the new headphones arrived was listen to it for reference since I know how it should sound so intimately. Obviously, determining audio accuracy is a tricky business, but I found the sound of the Panasonics to be boomy and muted.

Many details in the sound disappeared into the low-end. I found this to be the case in general, not just with my own music, but with all of my favorite albums. For their price, they are some of the best in-ear headphones you can buy.

Yeah, the Panasonics are quite boomy, but they have fairly peak free treble which is good. The Monoprice is by far more accurate. I have a problem with inexpensive headphones I use with my mobile phone.

The linked guide does not seem to address that. They have that wrapped cord, so they have a better chance of staying in one piece. Just got the Panasonic headphones and indeed after being used to sennheiser and soundmagic, they are clearly more neutral, but could be a bit louder.

Good sound overall, but you may discover you prefer a less neutral V sound as I have. Any other recommendations for non-sealed buds? Looking for deep bass. Wow I am so glad I followed this review.

No Maxell ear buds! A little bassy but woth it. XBA-1 is intended for those who seek natural sounding while SHE for fun and balanced, with emphasized sub-bass but no boominess….

I always double check with the PR folks at the company in question. It is good, missing details but full enough and no annoying shards in high or boomy bass. The similarly priced Panasonic kills it.

Not sure why joker theheadphonelist calls it a minor miracle, unless I got a bad one. The non-fake Gold Xiaomi Piston 2 is far better than either, with a full bodied sound and great build quality for 25 bucks.

A quick reality check revealed that, for me, the Xiaomi Piston 2 is better when EQing the highs down — at least for some music. The Koss KSC75, even if lacking a bit in bass, is still preferable in many cases where earbuds seem intrusive and isolating.

Not Available — including your pick. The ones in this guide? Just checked today and our pick is still there: Thanks for reaffirming this with your article. A scientist was able to distinguish broken in headphones vs non-broken in headphones on more than one occasion.

Good article on the subject. For someone who just has a bear of a time getting the smallest buds to stay in at the gym, what do you recommend? I have these, which are in your list, and absolutely love them.

I have these, the Panasonics, and the Monoprice ones. The Pioneers are my favorites but not by much. I like bass and personally, I think they could use a little more in some song genres like Metal and Rock.

MEElectronics is having a cool promo right now. They all have mics and buttons. I just lost my Ego-fits and this seemed like a fun way to try a different set.

I bought these a couple days ago at a Walmart. These earbuds at least, to me sound great. Thanks to your review, I picked up a pair of the Panasonics — and I have really appreciated of the great, clean, balanced sound.

My only caveat is on the color. And that pink… is really, really pink. Check them and others out here: Reply to my email ASAP if you can. Have you tried the Xiaomi 2nd Piston Earphone?

I bought a pair of the Panasonic earbuds based on this review, and I was extremely disappointed. With the tips that seal my ears the Panasonic are extremely bass heavy with little mids or treble—almost like listening to music with earplugs.

They are OK with smaller tips, but not great, and not noise blocking. Bought based on this review, very bass heavy, hardly any minds. That said… I do wonder how these compare to the Xiaomi Pistons.

When you do, could you also factor in cord noise to the reviews? Got the TCMs, but being an in-ear design with a plastic cord, the noise from minor movement gets amplified to the point of distraction.

This is a lot of great research! I got them as a gift from my Amazon wish list years ago. Unfortunately one side stopped working about 6 months ago — no sound comes through.

They also have the mic button. I keep holding out hope that someone, somewhere out there will see them and immediately know what brand it is. Please help identify them!!

Thank wireless headset is very good. Honestly, these things sound like ass. The previous winners, Monoprice, make mince meat out of the Panasonics, sound-wise, and for half the price.

With the Monoprice, you can leave the phones in your ears when taking a call, just need to take the phone out of your pocket to speak into its mic. I usually buy my earbuds for ten bucks at Ross or places like that.

My standards are pretty basic — I just need a level of clarity that allows me to tell the difference between a guitar and a drum and I need the earphones not to hurt my ears.

These fail on both counts. They are simply awful. They are so bad that listening to music through them makes me angry. They are simultaneously tinny and muddy, cacophonous and murky. They make every song sound like a coffee can full of pennies shaken in a paint mixer.

If you could shrink down an old drive-in movie theater speaker and put it in an earbud, this is what it would sound like. I have bought better earphones at convenience stores.

They smash and compress sounds together so severely that I can barely make out the melody of some songs. I have stormed off of treadmills in public gyms because these earphones are so bad.

At this point, I only use them in those few days after whatever current decent earphones I have die and before I manage to get to a store to buy a new pair. Whenever I use them anew, I rediscover that feeling disgust, frustration, and disbelief that no other earphone has ever triggered in me.

In that regard, at least, they are exceptional. I took your advice and purchased the Panasonics. I know that sound quality is subjective, but if you consider these to be the best of the bunch, then with all due respect, you do not know what good sound sounds like.

These things have zero soundstage, too much muddy bass that bleeds into the already weak mids, and the treble has no crispness to it. They also distort when the volume is turned up pretty easily.

For cheap in-ear phones, I have not heard anything that even comes close to the Monoprice s in terms of sound quality. Unfortunately, everyone on our panel of experts found the Monoprice had far too much treble.

The Panasonic are relatively flat in our testing. Is it confirmed that the cheaper headphones have the same guts as your recommendation? Thanks for the review, guys. Got them in orange which exactly matches my Sony Z3 Compact in colour.

Nice and bass-y without being ridiculous. Very happy with them. Thanks for the recommendation. So I think they wanted the distinction to be clearer. And my guess is the are on the way out.

I played jazz, rock, blues and threw everything at it and it still amazes me. The drive is too good for something at this price range. Bose had a bass heavy effect and very noisy amplified sound whearas the TCM had a distinct clarity and tenderness while keeping the bass optimal.

No distortion at higher volumes! No problems, they sound very nice, and they are really inexpensive. Now for the amazing part: I found them after that all tangled up and was pretty unhappy with my forgetfulness.

But I decided to check anyway, and sure enough they still freaking work! They sound totally great and the microphone still works as well. I see you folks are working on an update. Hey Stephen, the lifeproof should have included an adapter.

In this price range? The non-seal makes most headphones sound like crap. Apparently, those three button proprietary licensing deals are expensive. But they had a lot of reports of breakage, so we had to pull our support.

Not a lot of great options. Thanks for the reply I really appreciate you taking the time to answer. According to our experts they sound the same. My pair stopped working almost immediately after opening, and it seems many others have had a similar experience.

First off, Please do not spread FUD just because you had an issue. Out of reviews only 13 people have had issues — and none of them were failures upon opening like your issue.

They have a 4. Not to mention if you bought a pair from Amazon, you can return them, get a new pair swapout, or get a refund. Right now these are showing as Fulfilled by Amazon so if something bad happens you have nothing to worry about.

I bought them and they sound amazing! I honestly feel bad paying so little lol. Not only are these still working, but they actually manage to sound halfway decent.

So… no test on Xiaomi Piston? Too bad because I heard raving reviews about that so really wondered how you guys thought about it in comparison with other headphones you recommended here…. I think Brainwavz is very comparable.

It has slightly better treble but I think Xiomi has more extended bass. Both are very good. Even better than the previous top pick. Sound is fuller and more 3D. I hate untangling the cable of my earfones and hence i bought the soundmagic es Was it a good buy?

Note the Amazon link is incorrect—it goes to the version without a mic, which I discovered by accidentally ordering them. This is the version with a mic: Which would be a better choice?

Just because I have to ask: But it should not be widespread. So if it is, I will re-evaluate our stance. Meanwhie, let me know if you have issues with getting a new pair from brainwavz. I bought two pairs of these.

One of these I noticed that if you bump the jack it triggers Siri. Something is a little off in the wiring or maybe the button is permanently destroyed. Check yours if it does this and return it if it seems off.

This is a known issue with the iPhone 6. Not the headphones fault, but the design of the phone. In fact RBH put out their own note regarding this. I bought a pair and my music was turning on and off randomly.

Siri was also randomly being triggered, it stopped after a while but the remote stopped working completely once it did. We mention this in a guide. I bought the Brainwavz Delta with inline mic and after a week the left ear bud stopped working.

It appears to the connection from the inline mic. Just wanted to let you guys know incase other people were having the same problem. Having the exact same problem. Dell laptop yesterday and iPhone 5s today.

Well Brainwavz has been in the comments section helping people. I even ran a pair over with my truck and they still worked! They were so cheap and crummy for me. I just placed an order for them.

FYI, Amazon no longer appears to have the black ones. I had to order them from NewEgg. Thank you for the awesome review! Would it be possible for you all to do something for on ear and over ear headphones?

You guys truly did an amazing job reviewing all these earbuds! It must have been time consuming. Read more here at http: I was excited to see an update to this article, and immediately picked up three pair of the BrainWavz.

Two of them had defective remote buttons, with the same exact defect: Two of the pairs had defective jacks, which required wiggling just right. The quality defects aside, which is odd to say… is better than my beloved Panasonics though, so it might be a while before I get to the others as I the most common defect areas for me seem to be really well designed.

I am in love with the cable, the reinforced Y-connector and even the little slider thing. I love the sound, even after a few hours of break in, they sound great. Hi Voidstar, We are sorry you received a defective pair.

Please contact our customer service to get your units replaced. The BrainWavz Delta link on Amazon seems to link to a version with no mic. Am I seeing this right? Regarding the Brainwavz Delta: These headphones were great…for the one day that they worked.

By the 2nd day, anytime the cable got jiggled or was touched by anything, the sound cut out. I bought the ones without the mic, BTW Maybe I just got a defective pair, but after reading a bunch of reviews on Amazon and seeing some of the comments here, it appears that they are just of inferior quality.

One comment about the sound — these do, in fact, sound like cheap headphones. The best thing about these headphones, for me, was the fit. They were comfortable and stayed put.

Primarily my iPhone 6. But after reading some of the comments here, I tested them on an old Samsung Galaxy and on the headphone jack on my computer and had the same issue. Seems like an issue with the cord.

Swap them out for a replacement and try anything but the iPhone 6 first. Congratulations for the job! I think who want to buy a good earbud this is the biggest and best comparation he could find! Bought a pair of the Brainwavz a few months ago I already owned a pair of the Panasonics.

The Amazon seller is sending me a free replacement. Either that or headphones are just the most subjective item on the planet because these things sound terrible.

Definitely going to be sticking with the Apple EarPods. I got the Deltas a month ago, and about a week ago, one headphone no longer works. It sounded good and felt good until then. I mean I use it with my cell phone, and the mics are the weal link in all of these.

I guess most people use bluetooth, but I had been suspicious of that for health reasons, so I use corded headphones. But there must be others. What is going on? Too big of a knockoff market for those.

Maybe when that whole knockoff market stabilizes. Any chance you can review the Vsonic in an upcoming edit? IIRC, you can get different fitting ear pieces. I might be wrong but I swear our expert mentioned it before.

I have exactly the same experience. The diameter of the barrel is key, it has nothing to do with the shape of the tip or the material. Kilpsch and Etymotic and perhaps a few others have small diameter barrels and this is pretty much the only thing that fits my ears.

Any other models in this review that are similar in this regard? I bought the Brainwavs after I lost the previously recommended Panasonics, and within a month of owning them, the microphone button barely works and also continuously talking, like, every 10 seconds fires off Siri on my phone.

The fit and sound quality were fine and they seemed well built, but perhaps I was wrong. RBH maker of the EP2 headphones specifically addressed this and now includes spacer bars when you purchase their headphones.

RBH Sound promptly began to investigate these compatibility issues, attempting to substantiate and resolve any concerns as quickly as possible. Any earphone or headphone that uses a standard, 4-conductor 3.

Thanks so much for your advice! I went ahead and took a very thin piece of electrical tape, wrapped it around the bottom of the jack, and it works as expected now.

I bought the Brainwavs in late January after my Panasonics died, and the Brainwavs were defective upon arrival. This was with a iPhone 4s and iPad Mini Retina. Back to the Panasonics for now.

No, I have the same issue with my Brainwavs and static electricity. Visiting a place now in the mountains, with cold dry air, a di get constant static noise when walking with a fleece jacket on, as well as the random control and volume changes.

They picked a a poor material for the cable insulation, methinks. I have this issue with both my iPhone 6 and iPad Air 2. No, because it only happened when I was visiting the mountains.

I also bought the Brainwavs, 2 pair. One pair, I think I fried with static electricity in bed. It crackles with movement and stops audio apps as well. It turns out that the second one does the same without having the static-shock event of the first.

I use it with my Moto X 1st Gen. The Brainwavs sound great, but the Panasonics have no problem, and sound nearly as good. I contacted Brainwavs, followed their procedure, and now have my replacement buds.

I did drop your name and linked this article — I think it helped. Not to be contentious, I do still hear slight static pops in the new ones and, as they did before, they do pick up some kind of field interference near my nightstand where I have a cordless telephone and my other mobile devices.

None of this occurs with the Panasonics. At the very least, I must thank Wirecutter for their consumer advocacy and Brainwavs for their prompt and proper response.

Hey Tony, thanks for the response. Experiencing the same issue others have mentioned with the iPhone 6 music starting and stopping, volume fluctuations, Siri engaging randomly, etc.

I was previously unaware that this was an issue with the iPhone 6. Perhaps this merits mention in the review, especially since this article is predicated on finding a suitable replacement for Apple EarPods.

Mine arrived from Amazon with a faulty cable near the mic that causes the left earbud to clip in and out. Contacted them via http: The blatant Apple knockoff company?

One guy drew a circle. He drew a similar circle but use different pen. Then he sells his drawing. The first guy got angry because nobody have the right to draw any circle at all because circle only belong to him and he is the only one who have the brain capacity to draw a circle.

What are your views about it? I need to see the context of the comment to reply, but I think that there is an unnecessarily strong spotlight on us. If you look at the iPhone 6, iPhone 6 has been using the design language that has been around for a while.

The iPhone 6 is using design language that HTC has had for 5 years. You cannot claim full ownership of any kind of design languages in our industry. I would expect Jony to be even more aggressive than he was in answering this question.

Jony is one of the classiest people in the industry. I would bet you anything that he did not say the word Xiaomi in his answer. He is speaking generally about how he feels which is what I would expect from any world-class designer.

You can see the whole interview in http: Yes, I bought the Brainwavz based on this article. I just compared them to the Xaomi Piston 2. Clearer highs, better imaging, no contest.

This whole article is invalidated based on this omission. I bought a pair of the Delta. I use Galaxy Note 3. It sounds great but occasionally I hear noise and it either randomly fires up the voice control and sometimes either increases the volume to the max and sometimes to the minimum.

It made it almost unusable. I almost bought these top pick headphones based solely on this review. Then I read a bunch of bad cable, quality issues, etc. Then came back and read all of these reports of quality and sound issues… with recommendations to put electrical tape on them to get them to work properly.

Any thoughts on durability? Thanks for pinning this, just had the headphone jack snap in half from a pair I bought 2 days ago. But the comments about durability holds me back. I notice the update on the durability, but is it really?

Should be good to go. Can you recomend most durable in ear headphones with decent sound quality and easy replacement rules. I wasted a lot of money on Klipsch, Shure, Diddy beats.

I hate to keep boxes, receipts and am abusing my headphones badly.: Usually i have cord ripped off the jack. Klipsch fell apart within 2 month. It was 70 or 80 and no replacement without original box and receipt.

Bad company, good sound tho: Shure and Diddy survive about month. Try this guide https: I think I figured it out. When I select the Amazon store as Canada, it redirects me to amazon.

Just to add a note on the durability of the Panasonic TCMs, my pair recently went for a ride through the washing machine in the pocket of my coat and still work fine! I bought two pairs just over a year ago based on the recommendation from here and have been very pleased with them.

Even more so since the wash! Anyone ever seen any options with this feature? I second this request! Goes to show you that when it comes to earbuds no two pairs of ears are alike.

I bought your recommended buds and immediately ran into the static problem. Fit was tight at first but became more comfortable over time and now they feel just right. So glad you found something that works for you!

As we always say, so many factors go into what make someone like a headphone. Fit and ear canal shape can drastically affect how the sound ends up. These things are junk. Try getting a replacement.

There are new models out that are fantastic and Brainwavz should swap them out no questions asked. Hi Guys, you can check out http: You will be impressed! I really like the sound of them, but in some sort of way one side always ends up sounding softer.

Do you have any advice for a similar sounding airy earphone? I do not really like in ears but some work fine for me. Well, what you want is unsealed earbuds. Check out the Sennheisers that we mention above.

Also, check out our Workout headphone piece which should be updated in a few weeks tops. We liked the Yurbud s, which are also non-sealed. Wirecutter staff member handling this review: The one without the microphone is the exact same thing — minus a microphone in-line.

I wear a single earbud to sleep with my other ear to the pillow. Check out our sport headphone piece. We give them a little more abuse than the average headphone, and there are some that have reinforced cables.

We are currently in edits for the update which is huge, so we should have a new version of that piece in a week or two. I bought the Brainwaves and was pretty disappointed with the entire experience.

I just got my second pair of Brainwavz in the mail this week after static and inner ear shocking issues on my first. This set is worse and suffers from all of the problems of the previous pair as well as the voice commands issue, random pausing of music, and ending calls.

If these are from the new lot of improved headsets they still have a lot of work to do. And if not, are you ordering from a 3rd party selling for cheaper than regular cost? I received a replacement pair from Brainwavz and have had more problems with the new pair than the original pair.

Did the new version have the three button remote or single? And how was the experience getting the replacement from Brainwavz? With static shock from earphones, its not actually anything about the earphones or a defect, its caused by a build up of static, which in earphones is a combination of your surrounding environment walking on carpets, dry weather etc and usually the cable swinging, both of which builds up static in the earphones.

With the Deltas metal housing the static can build faster than if the housing were plastic, and usually in where the air is very dry this build up of static can lead to a static shock.

This is not specific to the Deltas but all earphones but more so with those with metal housing. The new 3 button mic are fair much better with the new iPhone 6, please reach out to our customer support again so we can arrange one of the 3 button remotes versions of the Delta to you.

Finally got a reply back from Brainwavz that was vague. They said the new ones would ship with a 3 button control and shirt clip, etc. Also agreed with thewirecutter on headphones ie.

Sony and ATH m40x. I went with the Audio Technicas but thought thewirecutter was spot on. When did they purchase them vs when they reviewed? So far, it seems like the headphones those folks got have been an improvement.

They know they screwed up, and they are trying to remedy it. And I like that in a company as well as in people. That said, I know that overhauling an entire shipment supply can take some time, especially with the dock-worker strikes that have happened that still are mucking up import timelines.

Thanks for the reply. Still no problems with them, but the rubber tips are breaking down. I know I could just buy more tips, but your review has really sold me on wanting to try the Deltas.

Mostly because I thought your reviews on the Jot Pro which I bought as a result and love and Sony recommendation I went with the ATH m40x, but also based on your review were in-line with my own taste.

By that time though… I may have moved on. My frustration is in not knowing if I order today, will I get the old ones that seem to have quality issues? Or, will I get the new improved ones?

Only one vague twitter response. So, that makes me wonder if anyone is even paying attention at all. From you reply, I think you get the frustration perfectly.

Sorry if our message about the 3 button mic was vague, let me first cover some other points you and Lauren have raised. Firstly all the Brainwavz Delta with microphone that have been on sale since early April will come with the new 3 button microphone and also shirt clip, the ones shipping for anyone who placed a backorder will specifically be the 3 button designed to be used on iPhones.

I am attaching a picture of the new remote to this post, the I indicates for iPhone, Android remotes will be marked with D. The Android specific remote will be available on Amazon in another week to two from the time of me posting here.

Within next week again there will be Deltas on sale Amazon that are sold through Amazon FBA service whereby Amazon stores and ships all the products themselves. The build quality overall has improved from each production as we continue to find ways to make our products more durable.

One thing I want to point out is the Delta housing are made from anodized aluminium, most earphones at this price range and even above tend to be made in plastic.

Gluing two pieces of metal vs gluing two pieces of plastic are very different, its a lot easier to bond two polymers together than two metals, let alone anodized, with plastic you can get a near permanent bond, not so with metal.

If the Deltas were made in plastic there would probably be no issues with the housing separating. We also spent a lot of time making sure the assembly workers know how to properly glue metal parts together, all of which has made the Deltas a lot more durable.

With that saying, earphones are almost always subject to physical abuse i. Our customer service team will also goto lengths to reach out to any one we see that has a problem to make sure they understand they can get a replacement and with very little hassle.

To answer why we have not posted everywhere the new Deltas with remote and shirt clip, as much as we respect our customers we also have to respect our partners that are reselling and distributing our Deltas in other markets, as some will have stock of the older mic, we have to wait for a little before the overall formal announcement on our own Brainwavz website for the newest version, this allows them time to move what they have too, but I hope what I have written here clears up what people buying on Amazon.

Product pages on Amazon are to be updated this week to reflect the new remote and also mention the shirt clip. I know what I wrote is a little long, but I hope I covered any questions and concerns that I saw here.

So, I just ordered a pair from Amazon to try them out. They must be on an awfully slow boat from China. Though that may be the dock workers strike issue I mentioned before.

Nobody in the import business has recovered. Apparently there was something like a month worth of backup delays. I forgot you mentioned that. Was just a little surprised at such a long estimated delivery.

These days, estimating nearly a month for an Amazon delivery is pretty rare I think. Looking forward to trying them out. Hopefully that delivery estimate is way off as they sometimes tend to be.

Fingers crossed, but feeling like I made a mistake trusting this selection and company. The amazon listing makes it appear that the Brainwavz headphones have silicone earpieces, not foam.

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They have TONS of amazing reviews. It so happens that I have owned about pairs of these — different models. That is just silly. Mine ONLY die when my parrot gets to them.

I still have a pair downstairs that are going strong after well over a year and they consistently just exceed every expectation. There are a billion different headphones out there. We respond with knowledgable, well thought out replies.

First of all, to clear something up: I get no kickbacks or special funding based on which headphones receive recommendation. The Wirecutter does have an arrangement with a few mass-retailers like Amazon, that help to fund the site at large, but there are many, many brands sold on these sites.

That said, if something is good, and not sold on any of these sites, we still recommend it, regardless. Other sites and magazines which I have worked for are beholden to ads to fund their existence.

If a company is paying for ads, and a product from that company receives a poor review on a product, that review is pulled, and never sees the light of day. The Wirecutter strives to be honest, and you can read more about that here: You may have noticed that some people on this very article had issues with the original version of Brainwavz headphones that we recommended.

And if the defect is the fault of the manufacturer, we want our readers to have a way to get the issue resolved, much in the way Brainwavz seems to have been doing in this case. But the difference is that the companies in question still had good customer service records.

Someone you personally could call or email if you ran into problems, and get a reply. I have a parrot too, so I know how curious their beaks can be. And I want them to have a good customer service experience if something does go wrong.

So how would you rank them on this list after that price shift? Are they a better buy than the Brainwavz Delta? I am looking for in-ear headphones that have clarity in their sound. I was also wondering if you took the quality of the audio file and the device into consideration during your trials.

Please respond quickly because I am looking for a gift for my little brother and his birthday is tomorrow! I swear I am not a bad older sibling, there were circumstances that made me unable to search for a gift earlier.

The MEA are nice, but I think most people will want a bit more low end. I bought a pair in early Feb from Amazon based upon this review. Came back here to re-read the review — saw that they were honoring replacements.

So went to the MP4 Nation site, contacted them and it was pretty straightforward from there on out. Just received a new 3 button remote option in the mail. They even managed to accommodate me asking for the black model my previous pair were white and quickly discolored.

Pretty satisfied with how everything went all things considered. I really want to like these. I got a replacement for a faulty mic, and after 2 months the right earpiece fell apart. I am sorry that your Deltas have a problem.

Most likely from the date of when your replacement was sent its from the batch before much of the improvements were made. Our customer service are going to reach out to you and see if you would like a replacement.

I hope you do get back to our team, please keep an eye out for our email from help yourbrainwavz. After all that, you have a specific iPhone version?! I actually stumbled upon these the other day and just received them today.

They go into the ear at an angle and have this comfort gel to make sure the earbuds stay in the ear. I ordered these Brainwavz Delta based on this article. But to me, they sound horribly thin, quiet and no bass.

I seriously wonder if I have a defective product, because of all the glowing reviews on Amazon and this article. I would recommend to try the different ear tips, including the Comply foam tips.

Normally with a good seal the earphones will sit tight in your ears and block out a lot of outside noise. If none of the included ear tips suit you, do try any other ear tips from other earphones you may like, the Deltas have a standard nozzle size and most ear tips will fit it.

Every ones ear canals are different, so sometimes a bit of tip rolling maybe needed. Also with anything sound related its very subjective, the two other earphones you have mentioned are more V shaped in their audio output and a lot more bass heavy, the Deltas lean to a more balanced sound, if comparing the Deltas to the M6, the Deltas will sound pretty bass anemic.

In case you feel this is a defect, one tell tale way to know if its a defect or not is that usually with sound quality performance, the sound will be different from one earbud to the other, when you get the same sound out of both, its usually not indicative of a speaker problem.

You should also try the earphones on other audio devices to see if the sound is consistent with difference devices. If you think you did get a problematic unit you can reach out to our support to get a replacement at http: I changed ear tips to the Compyfoam.

I think they sound better now. I work with a lot of different headphones and earbuds through out the day. From studio monitor headphones to cheap earbuds. If you are a bass head I can see the dislike for them.

But still I think they sound great for their price, and they do have a satisfactory amount of bass even though I listen to genres like rap and edm. I think due to the changes in design they were..

I wanted to mention something regarding subjectivity that Raz mentions. I too have the M6 and E10 earbuds. And, I really like them both. Even now, if I go from my E10s that I listen to almost every day, back to the M6 earbuds, the M6 sound off, or too sterile.

I just bought the Brainwavz and am listening with the supplied Comply S tips. They are exceptionally comfortable. They sound very good — not great. I bought them mainly to listen to podcasts and the comfort and sound for the money are good.

I have an expensive pair of Shure in ear headphones and these are actually more comfortable. For us gen x idiots out there who have always rented from the cable company, if I buy this cable modem, do I have to buy a router too and which one do you recommend?

My Deltas finally arrived today. Ordered 3 weeks ago with a bit of aggravation, so I was prepared to be disappointed. However, I think they sound great right out of the box.

Also tried the Comply memory foam tips that were hard to get on and back off. I did think the memory foam sounded a tiny bit better, but I put the rubber ones back on because they look more durable.

These go in and out of my ears a lot as I use them when I ride my motorcycle. They sent me a new pair but those died in about a month too. The Soundmagic E10s sound the best of what I had and have lasted through lots of abuse for the last year whipped on a motorcycle.

The MEElectronics are a bit weak in sound and thin, though the built quality is good. More mid-range than the E10s. Of all I have at the moment, these Deltas are hands-down the best sounding.

These have plenty of bass and more so than any of the earbuds I listed above. And, the shirt clip seems like an afterthought thrown into the box. Word of caution for those linking through on the Amazon link above — not all of the colors listed actually have the mic.

Just be careful when ordering as you might end up getting a mic-free set. My iOS Deltas with mic second pair, purchased in Feb. I enjoyed these earbuds while they worked, but their sudden failure so soon after purchase and the current return rigmarole is pretty frustrating.

First pair had no mic; when I lost one of the rubbery earplugs, I decided to get a pair with a mic. Now unhappily back to the Apple iPhone 6 earbuds while waiting for the replacement pair….

Can you post your ticket number here so i can check on it. The Silver iOS are out of stock at Amazon but we have some stock at our main office, so the support should have arranged the replacement from the office.

I think the customer service staff may have forgot that we still have some stock for cases just like this. Thanks, already found it, please check your inbox and reply via the link on the email.

The support team will get the replacement sent today if you can confirm back asap. Much appreciated — just did. When you guys do your next round, please include BassBuds from the UK. Found them surprisingly good and cute.

I just ordered a pair of the Panasonic runner-ups. Plus I needed a mic. So I included headphones in my last bigger Amazon order, and after returning some terrible Philips SHE in-ears, I decided to research a bit more and ended up here.

In terms of any warranty related stuff, if you are located within that market should you need warranty assistance then you would need to go through the reseller. Our resellers are quite good and you would get a replacement, but per their shops return policy, you would need to inquire with them about this directly.

If you purchase from the reseller and go back to the states then you could contact Brainwavz direct for warranty support. What if I contacted the distributor directly?

That seems to be the only way to know for sure… I mean, Amazon is in the loop, so the biggest concern is basically being annoyed by potentially having to deal with returns without a clear warranty policy, but as long as I know exactly who to talk to in such case, the risk is diminished….

You can check this list here for which country contact info would work best for you, all the ones listed are either the sole distributor or sole reseller within the country shown http: They fall apart — within a day in my case — and Brainwavz know it.

These hold a 4 out of 5 rating on Amazon with roughly reviews. Their support staffers have gone to great lengths making sure their customers are taken care of.

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You should have known that by rooting your phone you are modifying the device beyond its factory specification. You should have known that this essentially makes you responsible for the proper operation of the device; you no longer have the device manufacturer or Google to turn to when software that you have modified doesn't work as expected.

You should also have known that rooting prevents a device from complying with the compatibility test suite, and that this can affect your devices ability to function correctly.

You can't blame Google for this; as before, once you modify your device beyond its factory spec, you're responsible for supporting yourself. Rooting a device is at the owners risk.

You've now found yourself in a situation where a modification you have made to your device prevents you from accessing a service you want to use. That's on you; no-one made you modify your device, no-one said they would take responsibility for the changes you have made to your device, and rooted users are expected to assume liability for any ramifications and complications they face as a result of their decision to modifying their device.

This documentation is publicly available. You went ahead and rooted your device anyway. You're free to carry on using Netflix if you return your device to a state where the integrity of the device can be verified.

Or you're free to carry on using a rooted device and living with the compromises that entails. Furthermore, despite there being plenty of examples of complaining doing EXACTLY what you claim it cannot do, that is to change such decisions, you keep repeating that "complaining will do nothing".

You are a broken record, arguing the same "it is what it is" argument over and over so you can avoid actually thinking. An argument and yes, no matter how much YOU stomp your feet that it is not, it IS an argument that has already been disproven over and over and over.

You also ignored that there are many countries where phones are already sold rooted, or how such things don't effect using such services on a PC with admin rights which are the same thing, or the dozens of other holes in your logic large enough to sail a ship through.

There is no "you should have been aware" because this is a total lapse in common sense and my device is in no way incompatible from a hardware or software level, but rather, the app is purposely rejecting it.

Furthermore, they made no prior warning whatsoever. This is like arguing "you should have known modern cars could be remotely disabled" if a dealership decides to just disable all cars with an aftermarket radio installed.

I don't know where to even begin with all the broken wrong logic in that last post. You are free to carry on being a living example of "First they came", but don't come crying about how nobody else is listening to you because you could not possibly be any more wrong.

I DO have a right to use Netflix on my device, rooted or no, if I am paying for it. If you argue against this, you are wrong. People DO have a right and have many many MANY times in the past to challenge the "it is what it is" status quo, if you argue against this, you are wrong.

I have been more than patient with your insane thick-headnedness. At this point I can't tell if you are being willfully ignorant or really are just that ignorant.

Or just trolling, that is an option as well. There is no way anyone rational at this point can continue to argue the insanity that you have argued. I interpret personal insults as an indicator that the individual making them no longer has any faith in their actual arguments, and so I think it's time to call time on this particular discussion.

As you've pointed out, neither of us is getting anywhere. It's been fun, but once it starts getting abusive, the fun has to stop. It's a shame, because DRM Vs individual user rights has the potential to be a really interesting discussion topic.

I hope you get what you're after; and that the reality of the situation will change to be more in line with what you think it should be. Unfortunately I imagine the situation regarding DRM and rooted devices will only get more restrictive going forward.

You purposely instigate people into losing their patience with you, and then claim "I win because you got angry", especially when the anger is because you were refusing to understand the entire argument throughout this entire mess.

Root is, by definition, unsecure. Any time you have userland processes that have access to ring0 you are inherently unsecure, as there are no restrictions placed upon running code at that point.

And yet, there are ways to run it securely on PCs. Netflix and online banking would not be available on PCs if it wasn't. TANs are generated with an air-gapped extra device.

TANs on the phone are in general not safe and if the TAN is able to be generated offline, someone could use an exploit to root, steal the secret for TAN generation and boom, it's over.

My Bank Hypovereinsbank more or less recently blocked root and well I just RootCloaked that thing into oblivion and can do my stuff. Sorry, this is absolutely wrong.

You can still delete System32, it's just mildly harder than it used to be. If "new and default users" were not Admin accounts, they couldn't install software, so Default user accounts are higher than Limited accounts, but not as high as Admin accounts.

That's why they can install software. Linux users are not admins but can still install software, right? You can still run things AS admin by giving the permission at runtime, but since all that requires is pressing a button if your built-in admin account isn't passworded, which it isn't by default, one step forward two back, sigh and most users are too "stupid" to simply not press that button.

This means they're an Administrator. They have Administrative privileges. The fact that certain actions are blocked until you click "yes" on a simple UAC prompt doesn't stop this; they're in "Admin Approval Mode", which can be disabled via GPO if you care to.

If you buy a computer from Dell example, set it up, then go to System32 and start deleting. That account is disabled out-of-the-box. Please, you're digging a bigger hole trying to look "right".

How to prove this: Set up a new computer. Set up user default for MS. But I'm not a Netflix customer and won't become one. Whahaha, this has to be the most retarded move of the year in any category even Trump can't top this.

I'm glad i don't use Old Crap Flix. When he can vote in our elections I'll take his opinions of our elections seriously. It is highly ill-informed anyhow. Timeout, you are a Trump supporter?

No interest in your opinion neither anyone smart in the world. I wonder how long they'll stick with that premise seeing as how much public opinion expressed here is against them. Get the APK somewhere else or install magisk and hide your root.

Too many people root their devices and have a good reason for doing so and Netflix should not penalize them. Dude, normal people don't give a fuck about rooted phones. It's just the elitist twats who do it anymore.

Most people who root seem to be. The sentiment among rooters is "if you don't root your phone, you're not as good as me and don't deserve to have a phone. Root you stupid noob!

I've yet to see that Maybe you just feel like that because they do in fact know more than you? My first version of Android was 1. I've seen it for many years. How long have you been in the scene?

It isn't just rooted phones - Also unlocked. Elitists get their iphones and galaxy s8s from att and verizon. Normal people get their devices from amazon, ebay, newegg, gearbest etc. I'm sure Netflix are terrified that the tiny fraction of Android users who come to this site, and the similarly tiny fraction who root their phones, are bothered.

The rest of the world won't care. People aren't getting their phones from ATT, Verizon, etc any more now that they have to pay full retail and don't get a free or heavily discounted flagship device with contract renewal.

They are getting them from Amazon, Gearbest, Newegg, etc and moving their sim. If I owned stock in Netflix right now, I'd sell it quick on this news. Everything that isn't already mobile is going mobile.

Swapping providers is as easy as changing the sim. Almost every person I know owns an Android device, but i'm the only geek who flashes and roots his devices.

It isn't just rooted phones but also unlocked phones. Got your phone on amazon? Got it on ebay? Got it from gearbest? Got it from newegg? No netflix for you without jumping through enough hoops that you'll actually know about rooting by the time you get it done.

Are we conflating a carrier-unlocked vs. They are two distinctly different things, and I doubt that having a carrier-unlocked phone i. Judging from the posts here it looks like nobody who roots their phone uses Netflix anyway so I guess it's moot.

But the outcry sure did get them a bunch of free publicity. This is what Magisk is for. Magisk still requires that you unlock your bootloader, which is enough to trigger safety net these days, so that won't work.

I understand that Magisk is a great tool for modifying my system without actually modifying it. I understand that there are many modules that allow you to do things like hide root, bypass security modules, skin your system, and plenty of other things.

What I don't understand is how you can install magisk without unlocking your bootloader. Back when I originally tried it out with pokemon go, it worked well for a while, but eventually even just having my bootloader unlocked was all it took to throw SafetyNet.

If that's not an issue anymore, then great! But maybe say that instead of being snarky. LOL the recovery doesn't stop working after a bootloader is locked, only fastboot won't flash images but the recovery can do whatever it wants to, update the rom, edit system files etc.

That's nonsense, the recovery works fine with or without a locked bootloader. Only fastboot won't work but that's only needed when you don't have a custom recovery to flash images. In this case all it takes is a kernel that supports Magisk and hides the fact that the bootloader is unlocked, at which point with Magisk Hide enabled all root and SafetyNet checks pass.

I'll have to look back into this then, last time I used magisk it wasn't as capable, glad to see it's come this far. Can Magical Hide hide that my bootloader is unlocked?

Serious question, not being sarcastic or snarky as I was below. Magisk itself doesn't hide an unlocked bootloader it only hides root but must custom roms simply delete the verifiedbootstate - flag which in turn makes safetynet pass even with an unlocked bootloader.

Some older devices don't have this flag in their kernels in the first place so safetynet will accept that the flag is missing. Link to the patch that most custom roms kernels to be specific have to pass safetynet: This has been happening for a week now.

I tweeted it to Ruddock a few days ago. Just didn't put together that it was because I was unlocked. Google really needs to start stealing from the root community the way apple takes from the jailbreak community.

It feels like rooting is way down except for a few legal use cases. This kind of stuff starts to make rooting unpleasant. I already can't use fingerprint auth in my banking app any more because root.

I used rooms for like 8 years maybe? And a lot of the "new features" always come of the rom or root comunity. I'm trying to stay indoors, but is complicate Greenify for example, works at no root devices nowadays But is way better with root and Xposed Doze can't compare against Greenify Maybe at version number 20 root wouldn't be necessary I flashed a custom ROM on my Nexus 6 because stock was so slow that it was getting unusable, but screw me right?

In my country lots of stuff doesn't work on unrooted devices. My bank app, payment app and local cable TV and digicorder app all stopped working. Also s-health doesn't work anymore and soon Netflix.

Few people I've talked to online know what they're doing when it comes to root. Most of those end up breaking things. Rooting is far too easy and probably shouldn't exist at all.

You could say the same about anything, not just modification of phones. Maybe you shouldn't own a car if you can't fix it yourself, or have kids if you aren't a doctor.

Rooting isn't easy, it's made easy by the hard work of other people. It's not up to you what other people do with their property, you have no right to say that they shouldn't.

And if someone breaks their phone, what does it have to do with you? It's their hobby and their phone. You're not their daddy. You could use magisk su hide for the moment.

I too use a banking app that cannot be used on normal root proocess. Hrmm, every time I hear Kodi, I think of pirated content. Even bad publicity is good publicity. They are not going to publicly come out and say it, but the add-on's are the only reason they're well known.

I rather say Fusion and Exodus et al instead since Kodi is Kodi and you have to install what you want. Kodi is open source. If Kodi stops wanting to be as useful as it is now, someone will fork it and keep it doing what its users enjoy.

Kodi is just an open source media player. To watch any pirated content you either need to download it or install an unaffiliated plugin that streams from pirated sources.

That's BS my friend, Kodi xbmc has started on the original xbox and was made and used as a media player. So I think not a big problem. No, it won't work. Safetynet always fails if you have closed activated, or if you just have an unlocked bootloader.

Sometimes even by just having adb debugging turned on. I mean debugging is a core part of developing and any developer probably has it active. Yes, it's wrong, whatever, the point is streaming services made it easier for people, which outweighed the hassle of pirating it.

You're right, this kind of thing is what will get people to start doing it again more. If I can't use Netflix on my rooted phone, it's Netflix that'll go, not the root. Primarily for system level ad-blocking.

None of the non-root options can even compare. I refuse to allow ads when they have the ability to fill the entire screen and vibrate the phone. Even with being able to block ads, I still purchase the ad-free option of apps I support.

This will also have negative impact on many devices and average consumers even if they never unlock or root. A lot don't have Google certification, such as upcoming OEMs. Then theirs beta roms like Xiaomi and OnePlus that run awesome.

My first though after suddenly realizing i am on some ancient Netflix version and Googling why in the word it is no longer available and reading the article above was "what The moment it refuses to run on my rooted devices, my subscription is getting cancelled.

As simple as that. I was about to become a subscriber of Netflix after seeing House of Cards by PirateBay but now through the official channel because I thought that Netflix deserved my money But this movie will keep me at PirateBay I have a Moto G5 that I could unlock and root and I didn't it just because I wanna see how things are nowadays without root And I use a lot of apps that would work better with root Greenify for example So I would be able to use Netflix And I won't and will stay that way only because this douchebag move So happy that I waited till House of Cards release to become a subscriber Netflix should learn something from Frank Underwood Yes, because illegally pirating from huge corperations which constantly attempt to and successfully brainwash people into agenda using various tricks, is somehow bad?

You're not supporting the creators of the show, sure. Anyways, with your little money you wouldn't be benefitting anybody. The creators of the show, are well off anyways. Don't companies pay them to have their content on their platform and pay for their production cost and wages?

Then; they've already been payed. I'm not endorsing piracy. It isn't the best thing to do, but I think calling people a "thief" and grouping them with people who have actually stolen things off individuals which mean a lot to the individual and murdered some individuals in the process, is just stupid.

It's not the same as 'stealing' bits of 1s and 0s. Again, I'm not endorsing piracy, however there are a lot of good reasons to pirate movies and TV shows. People leave their families for months to give you works of art.

You can't throw them a few bucks? I'm legit, always will be. Also, tax helps everyone. Your wall of text is just trying to convince yourself, thief. A thief is different from a pirate, besides, they've already been payed.

And I was talking about TV shows and movies, but you're too dense to realise it. If I spend time writing code for software, and decide to sell a monthly license instead of a perpetual license, that is my choice.

Your choice should be to either subscribe to the monthly license, or to find a competitor software to use instead. Choosing to bypass the licensing checks makes you a thief taking something without the owner's permission makes you a thief.

If you want to own the movie and watch it whenever you want it, BUY it. Just because somebody stole your car doesn't mean you can go and steal that person's car in retaliation. There are laws and procedures on how to handle that.

Thousands of unjust laws have been passed. They made actions illegal that were not bad. Theft is when I take your bike and it's gone and you do not have a bike anymore. When I pirate, are you losing your software or your right to sell your software?

Plus, if you actually developed software, I'd probably pay for it since you aren't some big corporation. Think about if everybody thought like you. Now if that It's the same with the rest of the content creation business.

You and me, we're just a drop in the bucket when it comes to their revenue, but instead of scooping it out a spoonful at a time while adding water by the cup, somebody dumped the bucket over, there would be no money left to pay the content creators before content is even made.

The only moral of the story is: Pay for legit services then and watch posted content - the creators get paid and you get proper content without restrictions. The day the industry realize that DRM, geo blocking and so forth are counter productive will be historic.

Love my Moto G5 Plus. Best phone I've had so far - and that's coming from a number of Samsung flagship phones. It's so much snappier and the battery life is insane. Noticed this a little while ago.

The crazy thing is I'm not even rooted or interested in any mods. I needed to sideload the latest version 7. I'm keeping the bootloader unlocked so I can recover if my phone boot loops.

I rarely use Netflix on my phone but this is kind of annoying. I suspect this has something to do with offline movie watching which is amazing. You don't need to unlock bootloader to sideload the full OTA images that Google publishes on their website.

Not everyone feels the same though, I know I sure don't. The day Netflix stops working on my rooted devices which are what I watch it on, not my TV is the day I'll cancel my service.

No big loss compared to losing root. Tasker is interesting but never felt the need for it. Adaway, titanium are both irrelevant on my S7, I despise gestures beyond simple swiping in the Cardinal directions, and if stock Android is so perfect why do you need to theme it?

I have a s7 edge and the stockrom is full of bloatware from Microsoft, Sansung and Google. More than 20 useless apps are included. So yes the s7 needed root. Never said android is perfect, if it was there wouldn't be any competition in the market or users such as myself who feel the need to customize Android.

Root is not something I push onto others, its just something that I want on my devices and I make choices about what services I use or devices I purchase based upon my ability to do it. Using a non-rooted Samsung without Taller would be like using a feature phone again but with ads.

Having an automated device without ads and bloat is certainly a basic requirement to me. I don't see any ads on my Ericsson GF either. Don't have to install a single piece of software in order to get there.

Ericsson win, Samsung loose.: Your Samsung still has Google ad services and so forth running even if you are blocking them on the "non root level". My devices are completely ad free with Google ads disabled system wide and in all apps.

Samsung loose every time even if their followers are trying to find different "non root methods" to "solve" things that other devices do without any issues due to I disagree, Android is one big advertising if you don't use root.

Apps have ads not every app has a pro version, internet browsing sucks without Adaway build in ad blockers in browsers aren't great, YouTube really sucks if it isn't modded watch a 30 second ad for a 3 minute movie.

And devices are full of bloatware that can't be removed without root. Even the Google stuff are bloatware kiosk, movies, music, books etc. Samsung's Internet has the Adblock extension and it literally blocks everything.

I also use Disconnect Pro and Adhell for system-wide ad blocking. But then, I haven't needed to restore a backup except for switching devices in years, probably because I don't run janky community junkroms.

The only reason you feel that Smart Switch completely replaces Titanium is because you never used other features of Titanium that go beyond what Smart Switch is intended for. They're not must haves for the masses though but some of us do appreciate their usefulness.

I hate this response. If anything, I have found far more reasons to root than ever before. But you don't even need to root to get blocked. Just using a custom ROM or having an unlocked bootloader triggers it..

I really couldn't understand these kind of stupid moves. I mean I kinda get for an Android Pay or some banking apps to implement these limitations. But seriously, a frickin' streaming app? Afraid they're gonna get pirated?

For someone who's going to pirate, they probably could just probably reverse engineer the apk and remove the limitations or basically use older apps. Do they really have some idle engineers that they're forced to implement useless feature?

I'll come back when Google fixes this shit. Back to pirating it is. My app stopped working on my N7 when I sideloaded 5. Got an error when trying to play anything. I went and dropped it back to stock on the latest patch and relocked the bootloader.

All working fine now. Too fucking bad, Nougat is fantastic on that device, leaps and bounds better than Marshmallow. Which ROM and which N7 do you have? I am now on the latest Marshmallow just so that Netflix will work.

As long as I can side load it and sign in I'm still ok. It's a pain, but I'd live with that. But if NF blocks root users from signing in, I'm definitely cancelling and just use one of the very easy pirate apps.

As long as you can side load But going from "hidden app in the Play store" to "sideloaded app won't run" is probably on the menu. You're tired of people being smug in their hobbies, so you gloat about the problems inflicted on them pointlessly?

Petty and a hypocrite. Is another person's happiness really that painful for you? You already know that they accomplished nothing more than "successfully followed instructions. Humbling them is one thing, being an ass is another entirely.

Your wrongness-density is impressive. I didn't realize I replied to you twice. You're all over this article, with really, nothing better to do, huh? I'm probably done stirring shit up anyway, today is water change day on my fish tanks.

Are you one of those Samsung Apologists that argue against root and proudly tell everyone about the perfection known as Grace UX Trying to be an "anti-social elitist" is like proudly use Simple Finder on a Mac and tell everyone that you don't need the regular Finder.

I use Samsung, but only because it offers the best mix of software and hardware for me. And package disablers are garbage. Don't forget DT Ignite so the carriers can add their share.

It is always amusing when the Samsung Apologist proudly claim how good it is to live without root and how "mature Android has become" when they are talking about a heavily modified fork of it.

The only thing restricting them from further modification is the CTS in order to be able to use Play. An unrooted Samsung running Grace? It would be like having a feature phone again.

Way too many annoyances and no way of making it more pleasurable since the whole thing is The only area where there are some reminiscence of Android is under the About box.

Samsung is a disgrace not to mention a complete parody on the concept of an Android device. Not to mention their followers who recently "spotted" the bezel less display introduced by Sharp and LG followed by Xiaomi because The most kind thing I can say about that brand is this: Samsung is for the Android device and platform what McDonald's is for the thing called food.

There are way better devices available. Buying a Samsung is like getting a Big Mac the difference is that the Big Mac buyers doesn't claim its superiority - while Samsung buyers always try to claim how "superior" their devices are.

Everything in your first paragraph is purely subjective. I find the design of the Pixel to be ugly, boring and derivative. AOSP design language doesn't appeal to me. I also think Samsung's software suite is better than Google's.

DTIgnite is a Verizon thing. Bezel less phones are sexy, for sure. It is stupidly gorgeous though. I use Samsung because I like the software design. I like the functionality of the base is and apps, and I like the S-app suite.

I really miss my Note 7, and I'll be swapping up to a Note 8 when it's out. Don't get me wrong, Samsung phones have their negatives - chief among them is the fragile design and the screen edge touch rejection sucks ass.

But for me, the positives outweigh the negatives. Other phones have bigger negatives for me. Phone preference are always subjective. Somebody will always have a reason to pick one over another. Tell me, if Samsung is a "parody" of the concept of an Android device, what is your description of the perfect Android device?

I'm guessing it's the Pixel. My Xiaomi Mi Max is excellent but would be even better with the aforementioned hardware I can't fault is existing hardware but I am taking about a new model.

A keyboard flipcover would be a great accessory as well. Sony all the way to me if I really insist. No need for a Samsung in order to get it. The upcoming OnePlus 5 looks promising - they usually get their things right.

MicroSD on that one as well. Let's call it a Note Pro. What I don't like with Samsung are all Apologists making excuses for their policies. I have nothing against them as a company or production.

They can make excellent products but their policies stop them right now. It is too much McDonald's mainstream and too little class at this time. Carrier devices are typically too mainstream than the unlocked ones.

I dont see the point of a digital sound connection on a phone because sound itself is analog by definition and I think the DAC in a multi-hundred euro device is better than in some cheap headphones.

Google Play Movies still works right? Oh yes, so long as Google makes their money Everyone should stop using Netflix. Not sure how I'm gonna get the shows i currently watch on Netflix from bit torrent since they won't be made anymore once Netflix is shut down, but at least I'll have my bit torrent friend.

You can't buy whatever device you want because a content provider disagree. You can't use the system you want because a content provider disagree. You can't use the app you want because a content provider disagree.

The "improper way" is Samsung free, ad free and bloat free - and I don't need several apps because I have just one or two streaming apps, one media player, one book reader and so on.

Fast and efficient system to boot. Perhaps you can tell me the benefit of having Kindle, Kobo and Nook instead of MoonReader for everything. The benefits of having an uprooted system, Netflix, Hulu and a couple of apps for different cable services instead of having just one media center would also be interesting to know more about.

When we are at it: I dont use any of those. Phones are too small for media consumption. I don't have any video streaming or playback apps on my phone. Nor do I have book readers, but why wouldnt I want Kindle?

It's the only way to access the Amazon library Oh wait, I forgot, you do that believe in compensating content creators. If I put that on my S7 edge, I'd be wiping out half the hardware's capabilities in one blow.

But I can move the clock to the other side of the notification shade, woohoo! Oh and does the installer for RR rom repartition the file system? And on top of that, I'm immediately reminded of iOS when I looked at their screenshots.

I buy Kindle books but send them through a plug-in since the Kindle app pretty much suck in comparison with MoonReader. Sometimes I also buy from Google Play Books and it is also a trip through the plug-in for them and then into the MoonReader library.

You see - DRM is a stupidity that must go way unless they create a device wide scheme so any app can authenticate and show or play back the content. I understand that Samsung phones are too small for media consumption.

Small displays below So your listed features of your Samsung are hardware? They certainly sound like software to me. Or do you seriously believe that Samsung use co-processors in their device like Commodore did on the Amiga?

I can assure you that your Samsung contain standard hardware with a lot of subcontracted components, especially in the US market where they even use Qualcomm CPUs. Why would I use an OEM dependent payment system?

My credit cards follow a standard, why should I pick myself into a specific device OEM just to pay? It makes no sense. It is like having a car that only runs on Citgo gas or a 4" Visa card requiring different terminals than my 4.

Mobile payments will be a thing when a standard are in place. Payment systems requiring me to lock myself into a specific OEM just suck. Don't see the need. Don't like Edge displays with their optical side effects.

The Snap Camera is good too. Can set it up on my device but don't see the need when there are things such as Active Display and a lot of other options. I don't see any problems with gaming on other Android versions so I just don't see what Samsung can add in this regard.

Why would I want to strap my device to my face when there are dedicated VR headsets available for gaming consoles and computers? I certainly prefer to have a full headset rather than using my device as one.

They could be good but carrier calling is old fashioned. I use Google Voice instead and wouldn't consider going back to carrier talk and text. Don't see any benefit with having a phone number tied to a carrier of SIM card.

Having more than one for different purposes on the same device without SIM dependency is the modern way. That brand is probably the worst when it comes to ROMs anyway and a lot of my dislike of them are related to that particular issue.

Mainstream degenerated art is what Samsung represents. But I know the existence of people who don't believe in freedom of choice other than the freedom of buying their Samsung from their carrier and then happily oblige and reduction imposed to them all the way down to the SIM card dependent phone number and roaming charges when they travel.

It really is like a car that require Citgo gas and is unable to run on Exxon or Esso fuel. Samsung just are the Big Mac of Android devices. There are just nothing "classy" over such a carrier mainstream brand.

If you want to know what luxury are? A 7" device is too small. My tablets start at 10" minimum, and go to 12" maximum. Content consumption is unpleasant on anything smaller, and I barely watch anything on a display smaller than one of my 24" computer displays.

Yes, you're right almost all of them are software features, but they are locked out when you put a junkrom on there. Well, call me when Android Pay is compatible with magstripe readers.

My bank still doesn't support Android Pay that I know of, either. How shall I put this? I don't care about Google Voice. Or any sort of data-based calling. US data networks are still too unstable and limited.

I am pretty much guaranteed to be able to make a call anywhere I can see at least the tiniest bit of 1x signal, but if the data network is gone, or you used all your gigabytes, you can't make calls anymore on your preferred number.

A lot of these things you say you simply "don't need" them, and that's how I feel about root. And about pretty much everything you care about. I don't do ebooks, I don't do movies or tv, I barely play basic games.

I do listen to a LOT of music though, and yes a lot of it was stolen from when I was younger and stupider and didn't understand that without compensation there will be no content.

Oh, and BTW, Knox is a good thing. It's how I have system-wide ad blocking without rooting, and how I can have my Secure Folder. You seriously think Vertu phones are luxury? Vertu are tacky, garish and gaudy.

Look, I really don't care what your choices are. I'm glad you have the choice to find a device that makes you happy. But you seriously need to stop acting like your choice is the only choice.

And I hope to god it never will be, because at that point, Android will no longer be a platform that fits my needs and I might as well go to Apple. Because you see, what fits my needs, is a device that provides me with everything I have, out of the box, without having to modify it.

They give me everything I want, and nothing I don't. And when the Note 8 comes out, the S-Pen is going to blast it so far ahead that there simply won't be any other phone in the running, not even the S9.

Very is easy more elegant than a Samsung. It doesn't mean they are the best but way better looking than a Galaxy 8, which I have been tried and I just don't see any reason to get it because of the way Samsung design things.

You like to be locked down to a carrier. Google Voice work perfectly well here without any network problems. If the network coverage is so bad that modern services doesn't work I rather jump to a satellite provider if I really need the ability to call from the middle of nowhere.

I wouldn't get VZW and eliminate my device choice site to them being very restrictive about what I am allowed to use. Having a carrier dependent phone number is very I just don't accept such a limitation - especially not the thing called roaming.

I just switch my SIM card to a local one and continue to receive calls as usual. The beauty of GV. It seems like out of the box is the most important aspect.

I just don't know any device that has an out of the box experience even close to my requirements. Samsung is certainly furthest way from them. I just dislike their devices because of their design, software, carrier affiliation and serious restrictions.

They just feel like a budget device full of carrier advertisement and bloatware. Yes, I do take at least my Surface 3 almost everywhere. You say elegant, I say gaudy, tacky, trashy and fucking ugly, like most things marketed to people with more money than God and less sense than a cricket.

I don't know where you live, work, play or travel, but many times a year I'm driving in places, especially the highways, that will have no data coverage.

All your google voice hijinks mean nothing when you have dBm of 1x and the mobile data network is completely unavailable. I can still make and receive calls at that point, because Verizon, but you're shit out of luck because you only give people your GV interface is barf, btw number.

And yes, at this point in my life, I'm sick and tired of having to do the software developers' job for them. When I was younger I found all that rom cooking, kernel coding, smali editing, adb pushing, su manipulating stuff fun and exciting, but now all I want is a phone with the features that I want that Just Works OOB.

I also feel the way you do about stock android. It's design, included software, limitations and style are not appealing. And every phone is "a carrier advertisement", and has always been that way.

Until the S8, every phone came with a carrier logo if you bought from a carrier. I get what you want from a phone, I really do. You want a basic device with no features that you can add onto to do what you want.

But man, you gotta stop acting like you're the Westboro Baptist Church and Samsung is the homosexual community. Samsung is not the homosexual community, right. They are the mainstream community where everyone eat at McDonald's.: The homosexual community is more about being different rather than following the mainstream, i.

The day I really want coverage in "every possible place" is the day I get myself a satellite phone, especially if I am to drive in remote land where I can't rely on decent carrier coverage.

Your attempts to put down Google Voice is amusing. It is also amusing that you argue that hard against vanilla Android. Did you ever consider iOS or Windows Phone?

If I would dislike vanilla that much, down to a dislike for Material Design I would switch platform immediately. If I don't like the system the way its creator intended it then perhaps it isn't for me and I switch.

Relying on some third party OEM to "modify it to my liking" is a bit naive. I also notice your misconception about how other devices work. My device runs perfectly well. Samsung make pretty simple devices, with ill designed software full of bloatware and "added value" applications and services reducing performance and increase power consumption.

I would say bling. Then we have other devices offering more useful features, higher performance, lower power consumption, more elegant design and so on. What they don't offer is the marketing known as Samsung.

It's a good thing, actually - it leads to better value for money. You can start travel out of the US or trying to get your texts synced into your Google account with your carrier based service I am truly modern with my Samsung!

My phone number is also controlled by my carrier and I must pay roaming when I travel, which is great - more money to Verizon! Much, much better than using GV on a data plan!

The day I need "coverage out in the nowhere land" I either get the satellite phone or some burner for that very purpose it's a case of simply routing the GV calls to that thing.

I know since before that modern communication services are a bit alien to proud owners of carrier branded Samsung devices. It is hard to think outside the box - much easier to just use Samsung with branding and everything.: Good luck with your Samsung.

Consider an iPhone next time. Apple has a new one coming and it can give you some taste of what being unlocked means buy it from Apple Store. I think it can be enlightening, especially if you try the Genius Bar as well i.

I do want you to answer this question without a dissertation And page thesis: The day I know that I will be in need for 1X coverage on Verizon I get a burner phone with such support before traveling.

You make it sound like it is something really and truly unique with such coverage and that your Samsung is a marvel because it offer it. Verizon just introduced a flip phone with full support for their LTE network.

So it doesn't take a Samsung to get there. So no, I just don't need a Samsung even in the "1X middle of the nowhere with a broken car" scenario. If it is very important with calling in dead spots - go and check Iridium, GlobalStar or Thuraya.

I would go down that route in an instant if I really need coverage in "no mans land". So no, there are no single scenario where a Samsung is "needed" for whatever reason.

Everything that brand can do can be done with other brands. Why do you always write a novel? We get it, you hate Samsung like Trump hates Mexicans. I don't hate that brand is overrated and hyped.

Mexicans are approximately times more sophisticated and polished than any Samsung. They don't even have Knox, which is a major benefit. Now go and enjoy 1X on your Galaxy.

Don't forget the grave beer when VZW down, though. So I agree this is a dumb move but everyone is overreacting by threatening to pirate content. This is a niche problem as less people root now, especially since Android pay won't work when you do it.

So Netflix isn't any less accessible than it was before. It's not just rooting. Not that I watch TV on my phone Dammit Netflix, you make me want to go popcorn time route. My current primary phone and my iPad are what I use to watch netflix and both of them is stock so i don't have anything to worry about but this just feels wrong.

Between this and Amazon not releasing the TV app for my sony TV, which they support outside, popcorn time and in extension piracy just seems easier. As long as the Netflix content is visible somewhere a copy can be recorded so again, good luck with blocking.

Manually flashing Factory Image for Google Pixel is how I get me OS updates and I choose to leave bootloader unlocked, rather than relocking every month. So I guess they don't care about security for the few users whom might use Netflix VR with Daydream compatible device?

Faster speeds are useful for computer computer transfers, but I think this is not a common usage. Maybe when Google Fiber is everywhere this will be more important, but for now it will make very little real world difference for most people.

On the other hand, range of the router is important to a fair number of people, so maybe this would be important. Otherwise, all of these tests showing the throughput of the routers reminds me of digital cameras with high mega pixel counts and crappy lenses.

It looks good on paper, but does not help in any meaningful way. I do agree that testing reliability is difficult, but in my opinion, it is by far the most important consideration with a router.

About five years ago, I switched to an Airport Extreme which has been rock solid and only requires reboots when doing firmware upgrades. Maybe other routers have improved since, but I have no interest in going back.

That all said, the experts we interviewed have indicated that moving up to a higher classification of router will at least give you a better effective range — stronger throughput as you begin to move away from the router, both as a function of the different connection technology and the upgraded internals of - ac devices compared to some of their - n peers.

Because you stepped up, it changes the slope of the curve. Higgins by the way is very biased as anyone who knows this area knows form his articles. We lay out the facts pretty clearly regarding the Airport Extreme.

We also performed our own hands-on testing. Eventually, I am tired of it and sold it. Just bought an Apple AirPort Extreme again, and it worked perfectly since then another 3 months till now, without even 1 single drop… Just leave it there and it worked.

Many factors will affect how a router perform eventually, so it may just apply to me that ASUS is not doing good, but I agree with many people who left comments here. Reliability is also a big concern for router.

Unfortunately, reliability is also the hardest part to evaluate with routers…. Too bad all the comments including one I left just this morning got killed today.

The reliability concerns in particular, are worth mentioning. We have them archived. Do you have suggestions as to how to keep these pages pertinent? Maybe save archived versions of your old posts? One problem on this particular page was that you zeroed the comments significantly after releasing the new version of the review.

This allowed people like me to post comments on the new review which were later deleted along with comments from the older review. Anyway, a chorus of other people here echoed my complaints regarding stability of the routers and David has tried to answer those complaints as best as possible, so this is less relevant than it was when I originally posted.

Always room for improvement, though. Disappointed that benchmarks and transfer speeds were given such dominant positions in your ranking criteria. There is SO much more to router performance and overall satisfaction than the data points collected during a few test runs and file transfers.

It says a lot that your recommended router has 3. Its price and performance have to be good as well. Please see our previous comments about that, including the mention of all the features the Airport Extreme lacks, as well as the fact that its wireless-ac performance is considerably lower than that of similarly priced AC routers.

Throughput and range are important only to the extent that they differentiate actual performance during usage. The demands of the typical network user are well within the performance envelope of any of these routers.

With speed not a functionally distinguishable characteristic you should have given more weight, not less, to other factors. But holy smokes, did you see how highly rated this was over at another website??

You could put a lot more effort into defining two or three use cases and identifying the most appropriate fit for each. It was a primary factor that allowed us to narrow the field to a subset of testable and researchable routers, which we then spent a large amount of time testing and researching the features of.

Maybe you got lucky and settled on the truly best router in spite of all that. All I can tell is that you really only tested four routers and declared a victor out of that limited field.

If so, then I agree completely. My argument is that among AC routers, the practical speed difference to most usage by most consumers is indistinguishable. That is a pain, and Netgear refuses to acknowledge the issue or fix it in firmware updates.

This is great for setting up hotspots, as the 5GHz band is less crowded over longer hauls. Apple specifically does not allow configuring WDS independently for the 5GHz band, which halves the bandwidth needlessly.

For instance, the Microsoft VPN server built into Windows will not allow a VPN client to access services ON that computer…which sucks if that computer also happens to be a file server or database server.

Yeah, yeah, security, bad practices, I know; but for basic remote access needs… 5 Do any of the routers support multi-point WAN failover? Nor are people just replacing all their wireless N devices for the sake of upgrading.

If my internet is 4 mbps, would the 22mbps of the airport extreme mentioned in the article matter to me? Unless you frequently move data or stream movies from one part of your home network to another, you will be fine with a less expensive router.

Our updated guide to cheap routers is coming soon. Looking for some advice here. We recently moved from a condo to a bigger home 3 levels. I switched the modem to the one suggested by Wirecutter for a new comcast service here in the new area after the move.

However, I still have the same router. The thermostat has been replaced once just to make sure it wasnt a defective unit. In the same area but a level higher is our bedroom which has an apple tv and that room in general receives poor n thus slower wifi signal as compared to rest of the house — being 2 levels higher n in opposite end of the house.

I sometimes stream movies from macbook air to apple tv there and its a slow process which definitely pushes the Nest on the lower level to go offline. The R was 4th out of 10 in their class ranking.

And 3rd out of 3 is last place. A category that has a lot more options seems like it should have more tested than a much smaller category. You can consider this http: My friend bought a top rated ASUS router a year ago.

It craps out on him all the time. So much for your tests. I need it to work and not get phone calls about it. Maybe you should set up a long term test lab and start building a history.

Perhaps you should acknowledge in your review up front that the most important feature reliability is also the one that is most difficult to put a rating on. The point is, own the issue. It will make your review more honest.

They were always beautiful and simply to setup, but while they always worked, performance was horrible. Though hard to realize that until you try a better router like an Asus which blows Airports out of the water.

That being said, I get about mbps through Comcast and consistently transfer large files between computers. For more typical connection speeds Airport Extreme works well and still something I recommend to my family and non-technical friends who value aeshetics and ease of use over performance.

I am or was in the market for a router since last weeks as my Linksys Ev2 was going kaput. The fact that intrigued me was you selected the exact 3 routers which I did after my research mainly from the same source of course, SNB.

Although its working well no stability issues, rock solid but looking at the actual performance its difficult to defend the extra money spent without just comparing the technical specs on paper and saying that its fastest router at this moment both in terms of speed and processing power.

I am giving it a second though and might return this beast literally, its huge to get one from recommendations above. Just thought I would follow up on my comment here..

However, I am using Asuswrt Merlin firmware as it stays close stock firmware but still provides a lot of advanced features. Ive heard some decent things about it and my cousin saved plenty of cash with it.

You may be able to find an unbelievable item s on Amazon at a great price using this golden box of deals. Just checked and there are a few deals on this product. I went with the recommended Netgear Router and a Zoom modem.

I see this is a warning of things to come. But from now on, if I just call on my own, I fear the answer will be … sorry, not our modem, not our problem. The previous guide on that model was from Generally I deal with others have issues with routers locking up under load more than speed or range.

I have 1 AC device, and a bunch of N devices. Is there any drawback by having them all connect to the same router? Should I get separate AC and N routers? As an early critic of your decision to exclude the Airport Extreme from consideration, I applaud your decision to give it a chance to compete for your affections.

They way the reliability issue was skirted was also ridiculous. Really an awful set of reviews that nobody should use to pick a wireless router. One line mentioning it is fine but hardly would dissuade me from buying a router.

I as well am big fan of apple routers, primarily because of the fault you note — Not the fastest but most consistent. I do see value in highlighting what it does — simple and reliable.

Very few even know what UPnP, ddns, dlna, etc. Having reviews cover core areas and weighting them appropriately seems valuable. Stuff like airplay, usb drive or printer are core features while ddns, UPnP, etc.

What specifically do you disagree with here with respect to our weighting? Having setup both this router and an Airport Extreme, I would not say that the Extreme is easier. Well, in that case, then you have made a solid case for why the Airport Extreme works best for Dave you.

But maybe you were looking for more than this. Buyer beware on Asus routers. I was extremely happy with it, until it just completely died recently, and conveniently right after the warranty expired.

I it in tandem with a wrtn, which has also worked for years without problem. I have an external drive that I I would like to access from my laptop and from my wired PS3 while keeping the usb connected drive from being seen or accessed by my roommates.

Also there have been firmware updates since then that supposedly made big improvements in AC speeds. That said, the USB 2. Reliability and timely security updates are very important when it comes to routers.

My ISP was giving them away in a promo. I set mine up. I do not use Windows, so I cannot use the recovery tool. I went to the service center. The queue was very long.

Evidently three dozen people were ahead of me with their routers in hand. I was not planning to stand around and wait. I tossed mine in the rubbish on the way out.

I kept the nice flat CAT 6 patch cable that came with it. Fixed things up perfectly. Zero dropped connections thus far. I have the previous Asus router that Wirecutter recommended - the RT-N56U and have been disappointed by the need to unpower it from time to time to get it to respond again, and moreover, worse coverage than our old stalwart blue Linksys 2.

The Asus touts beamforming and longer range. But it only covers half the house form the same spot the Linksys covered the whole house and part of outside. Usable if you can see the router, maybe.

So, overall, disappointed and looking for a new router. But it has to reach and deliver. I need it to cover the house and patio. Did you ever update the firmware on your N56U?

We suggested readers update their firmware. Worth a shot at the very least! I do check for firmware updates monthly, so perhaps that is why I have not had any issues. I did just update it today.

The reason you found that TP-Link had consistently high performance is probably because of the chipset they use. If anyone remembers buying a laptop around when intels centrino was a big thing can probably remember wifi being awful.

Biggest pile of crap ever made. Constantly dropping link speeds no matter how close you are to the AP, and the driver locking up the card a couple times a day. If you DID get a centrino sticker you better hope you paid extra for the 5ghz version.

Atheros has been making some of the best radios for a long time. Sure the chips cost a little more, perform slightly better in noisy environments. Hardware is only half the battle, software will make or break an embedded device.

In regards to other comments questioning brand reliability. My Linksys wrt54gs was close to 10 years old before I retired it. My Netgear WNDR early version with atheros chips inside had phenomenal range and was fairly stable.

I bought it because at the time it had the largest onboard flash size of anything under so I had plenty of room for fun when I installed OpenWRT. I used to use the Asus version of the wrt54 for large scale deployments years ago.

By far the most common thing is the power brick dying completely or becoming out of spec. This goes for any brand. SO MANY router reboots and wifi reset have been traced back to the bricks voltage sagging too low under load that now my first debugging step for anything electronic is to change the power supply to my bench unit or something else overkill, then trying to crash the device again.

Keep this in mind, you might not have got a bad unit, but a bad power supply. There is very little room for error or even environmental differences, power supplies loose headroom as they get warmer.

Hi Weedy, Can you please send me an introductory email at michael[at]thewirecutter[dot]com? I was just alerted to your comments and wanted to thank you for keeping us on our toes.

I recently purchased this router and had to return it because of the weird Wi-Fi error that happens once a week: After reboot the router worked properly.

Have you heard of this being a widespread issue? Or is it just you? Had you considered swapping out for a replacement in case its a lemon before returning it? There are reports on Amazon that router requires reboots to restore connections: Is it possible you picked up a v1 instead of a v2?

Running the latest firmware? About Amazon — you are right, they combine reviews. The glitch started to appear after a week of usage and was re-appearing every days.

After turning off the router, waiting for 1 minute and turning it on again everything got back to normal. The same situation happened 2 times after that with the delay of days.

The third time it happened exactly 1 month after I received the router and it was the last day Amazon would be accepting the return. Otherwise people could get disappointed if they buy a router recommended by your very popular!

I could imagine that less technical savvy users who failed return the router on time would waste their money and would have to buy another router. Last spring, the 2. Now in October, both bands are behaving erratically on the replacement unit.

Pretty disappointed with the quality, but it seems all of the high end wireless routers have issues. This C8 review is pretty interesting. I was joking about a c7v3 above, but it turns out that there actually is one!

This was not there yesterday. Thanks for this article. When do you expect to publish the update where you discuss switching your top pick to the Archer C7? I agree when you said that reliability is important.

I like that it has a built-in VPN. I actually need that. It sounds like I would for sure be best served by getting one of these newer AC routers based on my toys.

Might give the Archer C8 a try, but anyone have any other routers I should take a good look at? Just purchased then newer version of the tp-link archer c8. Did you set the printer up wired first?

I probably could have got by with your cheaper router pick and perhaps I should have waited for the rewrite of your review. The setup was a breaze and I found the configuration menus easy to navigate.

I was upgrading from an old Linksys WRT54g and the range and speed differences are a massive improvement. As an added improvement over your value model USB 3. I had a 1TB WD Passport usb 3 HD that I had been planning to set up on one of my computers as a shared drive even though none of my current computer have usb 3.

Plus no configuration needed. I plugged it in and done I have 1TB of network storage that all of my devices are picking up. After an internet search I tried upgrading the firmware and was able to get it to work.

Performance difference between these products is small enough that ease of use is the real differentiator. I had no issues with the Apple time capsule I had been using prior to getting Archer C7.

I have not heard of this issue whatsoever. Thank you for the education. I learned a great deal. I also have enjoyed the comments and responses. I try to keep an open mind in all things electronic.

Clean power is important. Just as it would be common sense that folks would have a good reverse osmosis filter on their home water. I have been a Apple Mac user for many years along with the various Air Port devices.

Yes they have been reliable. And yes I am reading this because I am ready for AC at home now. I have a Samsung S5 phone and am looking to get a new iPad Air. I do want to consider the other brands and models.

We do some streaming. Thanks again and Happy New Year. It may look like a red stealth bomber but some of those features are quite appealing, esp the tri-band feature. You can check this http: A big thanks to The Wirecutter team for all the work they do to compile this analysis.

In my experience with the Apple AirPort extremes, you have the option of only showing one SSID to the user, and their device automatically picks the best frequency and channel. I think the point is to not buy forward or try and future proof your network, as they mention in this article.

You guys do great work…. Those are always good. Before I installed granite counter tops in my old house, I was going through wi-fi routers on regular basis. I had to reboot often.

It was especially annoying to my wife who worked from home and had to reboot her corporate laptop every time the connection would drop. After I installed granite counter tops, wi-fi connection in the kitchen area became completely unavailable.

Apparently, granite emits radiation that interferes with wi-fi signal. Unfortunately, that was precisely where my wife needed good signal. After trying to come up with various ways to handle this issue, including buying powerline ethernet adapters, multiple routers, etc.

At the time that would be the first Apple product I would be buying. I followed his advise and have never looked back since. All my connectivity issues have gone away. Solid connection, absolutely never have to reboot it.

So all these reviews I view to be utterly pointless. What good is a router if it does not provide a reliable connection and freezes every other day?! Please… As far as all the features, there are many other ways to get them.

They are mostly unnecessary and if, in a very rare case, someone needs something extra, there is a million ways it can be done. Oh, I also forgot to mention that Apple products, including Airport routers, have superb resale value.

You may spend a little less initially on a Netgear or something but in two years it will be basically worthless, no one will pay you more than a few bucks for it. An Airport router is easy to sell for good money.

That is a good point. Thanks for the info. SOHO routers normally bridge both radios to the Ethernet bridge. OK — potentially stupid question. I have Comcast, installed a few months ago with new equipment.

I have their standard wireless gateway which supports 2. What would a separate router like this get me? Thank you for the quick response. This is interesting… Just trying to make sure that I understand completely.

On a speed test, I get 22 down on a 25 subscription on wifi. Would buying the two devices get me better service and is it likely that they would last still be working and still be up to date 18 months from now when I recoup the up front cost?

Your laptop or the iPhone should have a dual stream WiFi card. Run speedtests from every corner of your house. People run their own gear for specific reasons. Right on — thank you. Again, he asked generic open ended questions.

Buying your own gear is an expense in both time and dollars. Both upfront and down the line. And the reason I do it is because EVERY ISP supplied modem will choke under the load my network creates now as of this hardware generation the stuff they give out might actually survive but I like my gear too much to go back.

My Asus N gives me faster performance in real world environment one floor up or down from the router in both 2. We actually source the review for the C7 on Smallnetbuilder. In fact for a large home I strongly recommend the netgear WNR, it is a range champ.

Having few neighbors to compete with for 2. We actually test the routers in different locations in a real-world environment. My router sits on my entertainment center hardwired to a smart TV but I need it to reach computers, phones, and tablets to bedrooms upstairs as well as my basement office.

Moving into a 4-story townhouse next month and I think my only choice is comcast. How long before next round to look at multi-story reviews, or does anyone have additional resources for my setup? You upgrade for security: Everything in the past 10 years has WPA2 You upgrade for stability: You said you can reliably get high speeds You upgrade for speed: You said you can pull your max over WiFi You upgrade for range: You said you get good speeds all over your house.

I saw this post and got myself a T-Mobile router. Yes but to get the speed boost everything needs to be AC. Better radios and antennas are still better radios and antennas. It just depends how bad your current equipment is in comparison.

This router is useless if you want to use Mac. I also really wanted the ability to use Back to My Mac to access the hard drive from outside my network and to use Time Machine backup. I should have read the review more carefully.

I bought a Time Capsule because I wanted to use some of these features specifically. You are right, this is a badass router — if all you want is wireless. But I underestimated how bad this router would be for anything other than that.

So I plan to return it. And I do plan to take your advice and buy an Airport Extreme I have an Express for the stereo hookup. I have mac devices all over the place, that said I think what you are looking for is a NAS.

I did a simple google search and found some more in other forums. Several people have reported issues when using two TP-Link routers together one main and one as AP as there is some timeout issues.

Whole house is wired 2 storey, brick walls throughout, almost all mobile devices use wireless N, and my internet is Mbps. The router is placed somewhat in the centre of my house 2nd storey stairwell, but I get a miserable signal in the kitchen, living room and no signal at all in the 1st storey guest bedroom or rear of the house.

It has been in use for more than 2. The archer c8 sounds good performance wise, but I need it to be competitive feature-wise to make me jump ship. How can this router be rated the best when is has proprietary firmware installed.

If someone needs a new Wi-Fi router, purchase one with third party firmware installed. You are assured of out of warranty support for firmware updates. They stock firmware works well, and installing say OpenWRT is easy.

Hardly a ringing endorsement from the user base. Hardly a ringing endorsement! The 1 and 2-star ratings may be attributable to the buggy v1 iteration which the article alludes to. The current iteration is v2.

I would take any ratings on a website with a grain of salt. More people are likely to write to complain, then a star endorsement. And why is everyone on New Egg a tech genius with level 5.

So much left to learn. I basically have an all Apple house not by design, just kind of happened and my priorities are stable connections for the two laptop MacBooks, good streaming through Apple TV with ethernet connection and with iPads.

It seems like the performance of the airport base station is not great for the money. My current router is old, so anything will be an upgrade. What do you think of the ac66u?

Should have it tomorrow night. I have an older Time Capsule that is currently my wireless router, that I want to replace, but continue using as a Time Machine drive. Does anyone know if I can then turn off the wifi on the Time Capsule and hook it up to the new off-brand router as a Time Machine drive?

Or better to go with the crazy expensive Extreme? Thanks for the info, works ;like you said. With the nettgear I was getting. I bough the tp link archer C7 and was able to get 7 mbps per second.

Good enough since it has to go through some thick walls. Its not in a house, its in a apartment buildning in manhattan. Thick walls that kills a regular routers signal quickly.

My backup plan is to go with the Motorola SB cable modem and attach an older AirPort to it for wifi. Look at one of the previous comments below from Matt on Feb 26 where the mods answer the same question.

Also visit this link: Those routers will work fine with Comcast. You need to make sure you have a modem though. If you need any help let me know! It just gives me…. I love this router when it works, but this is stupid frustrating to have a file that should fix mac problems in a downloadable format that does not seem to be compatible with a mac.

Try the free program UnrarX. Sometimes lemons do come along. Also — is this a V1 model then? I am having the exact same problem with my C7, purchased on the recommendation of this site. I think they spell it Securifi: Any insight you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

AC only gives you a Mbps boost on 2. Hi David and Tony, great insight and assistance… Thanks for all of your help and quick response!!! Also, their changelog claims OpenVPN support, but neither I nor people on their forums see any evidence of that.

OK, so after updating my router, how do I determine which version of We have two kindle fire, a gen one iPad, a gen 2 iPad, three new iPad minis, and four laptops of various ages?

First-gen iPad is a no. That came recommended to me, and swould love to compare to your choice. We only considered the top three routers in each class among other factors.

Here is what our expert had to say below — https: Thank you… I put mine in high central location and turned off the lousy cable provider WiFi. The most importat is router reability, stability, high power wi-fi signal.

Once you configured Mikrotik, you can forget it forever. It can handle many sessions torrent download, internet browsing — not problem, at the same time. The only drawback, that configuration a little bit tricky for average user.

The funny part begins when you start configuring serious networking firewall, vpn, iptv…. Anyway I just wanted to share my knowledge about good product, maybe oriented to advanced user.

I found this site very useful, it saved my time reading long reviews, opinions and narrowed my choices in voice recorder deals. I am a user since version 2. Most other computer software products rehash their UI about once every two years and include pretty pictures for example, Microsoft Windows, to convince customer that their product is brand new, and as a result, one has to learn them from scratch.

Still you can compare the values relative to one another. For example, the RBGx2 has twice the throughput. The devices in particular in metal chassis are built well, and will last if not heavily abused.

Many users are impressed with the 1 watt power, while others are disappointed when they hear interference on the crowded 2. You can create a link between two buildings on a private, unoccupied channel.

Additionally Mikrotik offers Wizard software for basic setup. I would recommend this to anyone born after who wants a sold, fast, and reliable home wireless router.

It was fantastic support. To greatly simplify things, wireless-ac can give you more throughput at a longer range, effectively increasing the distance you can go from your router and still have a working signal.

Just speaking in general terms. With all of this said, it really is a great router! The level of granularity is mind-boggling. Who cares about AC speed? People who have a lot of high speed local network traffic.

I own a ton of my own blue ray video and stream it over the wireless networks to computers, mobile devices, and televisions at home using Plex software. On top that that is wireless whole-home audio streaming, backups to my wireless backup device, backups to the cloud backup service, and normal Internet traffic on top of that.

Placed an order today. Finally an honest review about a router; and finally a reliable and fast router that is not a piece of junk! Just bought an Archer C7 and never could get great speed out of it.

Here was my setup. Ran speed tests with iPerf and also with rsync. The only client on the network at the time of testing was the Retina Macbook Pro. Right after rebooting the Archer c7, while in the same room about 5 feet away from the router my speed would peak at around mbps.

After about 10 min of operating, that speed would drop to around mbps and would never recover until another reboot. I tried numerous setting changes and configurations and could never get anything to work reliably.

I can, using the same test methodology, get around mbps out of the same laptop and that speed stays consistent no matter how long the router is on. I also get much better range out of the router.

I really really wanted to like the TP link because it was so much cheaper, but I could never get it to work right. I wonder if maybe I got a bad unit or something, but the speeds I saw were fairly consistent with what PC Magazine saw out of their unit.

What version of the Archer C7 did you get? Are you having this issue on 2. Are their signals strong? Just trying to get a sense of all things. It was Archer C7 V2. It was 5ghz with an 80MHz wide channel.

I did a site survey and there are no visible networks in the 5GHz range that I could see. I never tested 2. Yeah, I just returned it. As another anecdote, I tested range on both of them and the Asus router is so much better, both in usable range and in speed per distance.

Its not even in the same ballpark. I had a previous What do you expect the lifespan of one of these routers to be? I presume it varies with each device? People who are looking for reliable vpn tool that they want to connect with this router so here some good tools available but these are paid tools not free..

Here some best vpn servers for USA you can find and choose the best one as per your requirement: Would you recommend that i buy the Archer C7 v2 and see if that fixes the issues or just go with another powerline setup?

We also use Netflix and MLB. One last question for the wirecutter team, and more so out of curiosity what WiFi-Routers do you all use in your own setup. Not going router, to powerline, to xbox?

You might want to skip right over the C7 to the Archer C8, which is our budget pick, if they have it. However WPS is a security issue as you pointed out so I decided to look into how easy it was to disable.

Can someone with the C7 v2 and latest firmware confirm this? This link below should take you to the user manual, page 36 section 4. I believe this is talking about the latest firmware, but will updated my post when I get home to check if I can disable it on my C7 v2.

It seems the person in the thread claimed the software lets you click the button to disable it but when they used a Wifi analyzer the 5GHz band was still allowing WPS.

Yeah looks like the last post was in September so hopefully that newer firmware did fix it. At least with the pin disabled it means, if the wps button still works you need access to the physical router.

Awesome thanks for the info! I also received an email back from their tech support claiming it was fixed. I bought the Archer AC C7 thanks to this. Configuring the C7 was a breeze, easier than most and certainly not hard by any definition.

I want to buy new Wi-Fi router, in my case we use the router not for internet, we use it for local network, we have server and access this server from many devices with windows OS and Macbook OSX, and we need faster router and cover long rage with more than 8 devices access the server with wifi in same time.

So you think Archer C7 v2 is good and enough? I dont care about price i care about performance and stability and cover long area. I mean, the Archer C7 v2 is plenty fast. I have no issues with AirPort Extreme range and I install them all over the place.

If you are having issues, you may consider adding on a wired Express to expand your range. I hated having to run 2 WiFi routers to get decent coverage with my Time Capsule.

In addition, for a lot less money, Asus routers also provide free dynamic DNS. I upgraded to an RT-AC66 and gave me the same features as the Time Capsule at a lower price and I only need to manage a single device thanks to the range.

In a small area and with very basic needs, Time Capsules are a high quality and reliable solution, but they fall short in several areas when compared with routers in the same price range.

The Airport Extreme has good reviews, is easy to set up and comes with a few Apple-exclusive features, but it costs too much and you need a clunky utility to configure it with Windows computers.

Also absent are access logs, bandwidth limits, and any LEDs to show what Ethernet ports are connected or whether your Wi-Fi is transmitting data. Thanks for all the info. I got the c7 about a month ago and it did made a difference from and old solid belkin.

I have some questions however and I need some input to improve my network. First off my cable internet package was at 50mbs download. So after installing the c7 my download speeds went up from 35mbs ish to 45mbs in the 2ghz and 75mbs in 5ghz.

I then upgraded my internet package to mbs download. After rebooting everyhing the download speeds in the 2ghz stayed at less than 50mbs, however the download speeds in the 5ghz did went all the way up to mbs.

I already try to choose the best channels but no difference. It has excellent range but the speed is not any higher even after upgrading to double the speed in my internet package. It depends on how many devices are sharing the 2.

Where I live there is a ton of noise on 2. Some examples of sources of interference for 2. But there are more sources including nearby wifi networks! Yes there are plenty of wifi networks around our condo complex.

And also there are about 4 phones, 3 ipads and 2 apple tvs in the houselwold. I only have an imac in the 5ghz network. Should I just ran everything through 5ghz? Look to see if competing wireless networks are present on channels 1, 6, and 11 on the 2.

And be sure to walk around your home or apartment—wherever you mostly use your Wi-Fi networks—to see how the situation changes. You might be able to get away with assigning your network to one of the other major channel if it happens to be free.

Also, try forcing the router to run 20Mhz channels — that might make a difference if you have a ton of Wi-Fi interference on half of your 40Mhz channel setup. I think they are worth mentioning.

I already have an N14U with padavan custom firmware and it is just awesome. I am thinking about buying one of the others I mentioned and your thorough testing attitude could help me and others a lot in my choice.

No we had it as our old old favorite pick, then demoted it to runner-up way back in August https: Hopefully the C7 solves my woes. I sold my rt-n56u last night. Wireless-n is only really going to be applicable in our Cheap Router article.

I need the best router money can buy which can cover the biggest amount of range? Can you advise me please? Were we being compensated, I highly doubt the paying company would be thrilled with us suggesting their direct competition in the very same review.

FWIW, our previous top pick recommendation router is still going strong for my mom long after 6 months I bought it for her. As for failure, Amazon is always quick to fix things up same goes for the customer support at most of the router makers.

And when I have a question, I talk to someone in California who has a clue and takes care of business. The AirPort can handle any house under 2, sq ft comfortably, and more importantly, expanding with an additional airport express or extreme is a breeze.

I understand — fanboy this fanboy that. I am great with PCs, and install majority Microsoft products. However, because I hate troubleshooting wireless networks and just want my stuff to work, the AirPort Extreme is my model of choice So, while for your case it may make a lot of sense to get uPNP, the other benefits of the APE make a lot more sense for the average user in my context, and the clients I serve are usually thrilled with the performance.

Especially telling is that I mentioned to my mom that she ought to try the AirPort extreme to fix the wireless range issues at her house thinking she would wait until I was in town to buy and install for her — a few weeks later she mentions how much she loves having internet without issues throughout the house.

The house is 3, sq ft and the AirPort is in the farthest corner of one side thanks, Cox. My bedroom at the opposite end of the house from the APE was the only spotty room. The ones that you wire-in to your existing network are fine, but save me a trip out to your home or business — steer clear!

While some people might not explore anything their router can do, there are definitely Wirecutter readers who are interested in getting the most out of their device that they possibly can. That, and the Extreme is way too expensive for what it offers.

At that point, you might as well get the Nighthawk and be done with it. There are a lot of reasons why, but the biggest one is that it just works, without interruption, for a long time.

Other routers over the years have been prone to requiring reboots as they get older, degraded performance overall — the AirPorts have a track record of working, and working well, without being touched.

The Express gave up the ghost and did the yellow blinking light of death and the Extreme just needed to be rebooted about once a month to continue working.

Just my 2 cents! You do realize other people have other experiences? You think that all other routers fail except Airports? Your fanboy mentality really is showing.

In the trouble shooting section of the set up instructions…. A Youtube video or something on a flash drive set up video would work…but this thing is basically all Chinese converted to English!

Nah, the non-geeks should contact geeks if they want advanced hardware to be configured properly. Now the AirPort covers the backyard 3rd floor, bedroom closest to backyard.

Which is an almost direct shot down a stairwell. Over dB in the front of the second floor. Totally with you on that one. However, the Airport Extreme is also absurdly overpriced for the performance and features it offers—at least, based on our comprehensive testing.

And the performance may not be as good as other AC routers, but what about consistency and stability? I think for majority of consumers, these are more important attributes than faster speeds.

Routers are not complicated gadgets. They are easy to configure and use — but the complication comes in the fact that there are a gazillion different routers out there.

This is probably the best guide on routers I have read. I think if you are looking to get a vpn working on that, you may want to look at http: Can you also post the list of the 21 routers you claimed to have tested in the introductory title?

If that is the case, then your opening sentence is incorrect. This does raise a question from me as to how you came to the conclusion of what is the best router for most people if you only tested a subset of the 21 routers.

What about the others you researched? Thanks for letting us know. In the opening title, you mentioned a research was done on 21 routers. This is not mentioned again in the rest of the article.

But it seems they are not. This leads to the confusion, why have 4 finalists when you are not even going to consider all 4 for testing. But the other comment I have is the results charts do not show comparative results for all 9 routers simultaneously.

Now I understand all tests where not done at the same time when all routers were possessed by the team, but it is not very good to have subset comparisons of routers and use this information to conclude one best router out of them all.

TP-Link gets too much criticism for their UI. Just a basic HTML form that works in every browser, including older ones, without using too much system resources on the client or the puny little device.

I also like that the web UI has stayed the same. You can read any guide about a TP-Link and use that for reference. The documentation in the panel to the right is also helpful and technically accurate without marketing buzzwords.

I do not like how a reboot is required to apply many settings on a TP-Link, but that is not so much a matter of the UI per se, as the operating system behind it.

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